Need advice about commercially produced veggie meat.

According to the FAO Twenty-six percent of the Planet's ice-free land is used for livestock grazing and 33 percent of croplands are used for livestock feed production.

As PFL cattle are not consuming any of the 33% of the worlds land going to cattle feed, that suggests to me that, even though stocking rates are lower, when considering the pasture stocking rates of industrially produced cattle, you then need to take into account the 33% of the land growing fodder crops, and that may make stocking rates lower than with PFL cattle

Emissions from cattle farming are not just methane. For industrial raised cattle there are also a very high rate of CO2 emissions, from the manufacture and use of the inorganic fertilisers, made synthetically through an energy-intensive process using natural gas and applied to both fodder crops and pasture. Then there are the emissions from the transport to take the feed to the farmer, often involving long sea journeys. Much of the forest land destroyed in South America is cleared to grow soya for cattle food.

The manure produced by intensive cattle farming is also a problem. It has to be stored until used and it is a potent producer of methane. With PFL farming the cattle are returning their dung back to the ground, where it is quickly colonised by bacteria and insects, broken down and returned to the soil as a natural fertiliser.

I understand the upside of Pasture for Life but doesn't it take more land for grazing or growing winter feed?

Baggs, by fertilisers I was meaning the chemical kind.

No fertilsers go on the land which PFL animals graze

Manure is natural fertiliser. The grazing animals' manure goes on the land. So PFL meat raising is totally sustainable as well.

M0nica ??

VQ Pasture for Life cattle are more environmentally friendly because no fields are given over to growing food to feed them, foods like soya and maize which are grown in fields that require fertilisers, pesticides and weed killers (The first genetically engineered seeds were soya and the purpose was to make the crop resistant to the weed killers used on competing growth) nor does this food have to be transported many miles in lorries and ships. No fertilsers, pesticides or herbicides go on the land which PFL animals graze, again much better for the environment and since all fertilisers, insecticides etc produce emissions in manufacture, once again this makes this way of feeding animals more environmentally sensitive.

Because PFL animals only eat grass and hay, the food they are adapted to eat, rather than soya and maize, which their bodies struggle to digest, yes, they do produce less gas.
Unlike soya and maize fed cattle they are healthier, and need less vetinary attention and are not routinely fed antibiotics, which make their way through them into the human food chain, making a major contribution to the problem of bacterial infections becomng resistant to the normal run of antibiotics.

PFL being environementally freindly, is not just a question of cow farts. It is what they eat, where it comes from, the production and use of fertilisers and insecticides and weed killers, how all those things are transported.

The meat I buy comes from downland that has no weedkillers or fertilsers put on it. The sward is rich with wildflowers and these attract butterflies and birds. It is win win all round.

Like 25 AValon I do not want to go vegetarian or vegan, but smaller quantities of good meat from cattle reared in a way that enables them to enjoy their life in a way they have done for thousands of years, is the best of both worlds

Loads of articles on pastureforlife.org website vq. Cows feeding on grass are part of the carbon cycle. Cows and humans and vegetation give off carbon but cow manure encourages microbes in the soil which absorb carbon and it gets sequestered so there is more of it locked into the soil than is released. Cows thereby facilitate this process so there is less carbon. But only if they are grass fed. Grain fed cows not only release carbon but land is taken up to grow the grain they are fed on and then there are transport costs.

If we go down the pasture fed route it would mean less meat than you get from intensive farming which to me is pretty abhorrent. So a mix of eating less meat and more vegetarian is necessary. There is of course all this fish especially shellfish which we currently have in abundance that we could be eating.

How are pasture fed cattle more friendly? Do they break wind less often than other cattle? This is a serious question. I'm genuinely interested. Well not in cattle flatulence but whether some sorts of feeding cause more flatulence and therefore more methane than others.

Chardy not if it is pasture fed animals as M0nica says. That is the only meat I eat. Also pasture fed animals are carbon friendly.

Yes, that is so, Chardy, which is why I buy Pasture for Life meat, because the animals are not consuming any specially grown fodder crops at all.

Cattle digestive systems are not adapted to digesting soya and maize and are therefore more likely to be ill, which means that they are on continous doses of antibiotics.

25Avalon Google 'soya production for animals' and most responses will say that over three-quarters of soya production is for animal feed.

I must admit to having had a sausage sandwich the other night and relishing it! On the rare occasion that we have steak we always have a sausage with it and I always prefer the sausage. Back to home made tomato soup today though.

But a sausage, like a burger or a rissole merely defines how a product is made, not what it contains. I love the Linda Macartney sausages, also those from our local butcher. I prefer beanburgers to any other kind of burger because I do not like large lumps of meat - and I include burgers made from meat in that definition.

I do worry that an enjoyable and varied vegan diet is perhaps too dependent on processed foods and ingredients imported from abroad. Everybody's diet will contain imported food these days but I think, it is easier to eat a varied diet, with limited quantities of imported food if you are free to eat any edible substance available, including meat and dairy than if you are limited to non-animal foods only.

Pretend meat is for people who are used to eating meat and like it, but would rather not eat it, or want to eat less of it, for a variety of reasons. If you dislike meat and the thought of it being a dead body and all the blood and bones etc, you wouldn’t want to eat the fake variety anyway. So, some people will try it and others won’t, simples.

I batch bake a nut loaf and a bean loaf - slice them and put in the freezer - they last me ages. One slice in the microwave for a few minutes and I have the "meat" base for my meal when DH is having sausage or brisket, etc. I worry that ready made veggie food can be very high in salt.

Mmmm, you know veggie hot dogs are VERY good.

So does a lovely hot dog, with onions and mustard.

Aubergine red lentil and mushroom pasta sounds lovely.

Mock ham(soya ham) seemed a good idea for a ready made protein that could go in a sandwich. Aftet tasting it I decided I'd rather have baked beans on toast.

Be careful about Soy as it is more harmful to the planet than pasture fed meat. They chop down forests to grow it and then it has to be transported here so it is not environmentally friendly.

If you are vegetarian as opposed to vegan there are loads of delicious meals. Aubergine parmigiana has a good meaty texture with no meat, Cauliflower cheese, mushroom risotto, aubergine red lentil and mushroom pasta, are all some of our favourites although we still eat meat which has to be pasture fed and preferably organic.

I’ve got two friends that have been vegetarian for most of their lives, both my age or older. One said that as a child she hated the texture of meat and could only eat crispy bacon. The other one saw some lambs in a field and decided there and then that she couldn’t eat meat. I don’t know how old she was at the time. Neither of them have ever had pets, not because they disagree with pet ownership. I’ve always found that strange with the second friend who, unlike the first one shows no interest in my dog or animals in general. I have to be honest here and say that, although I understood vegetarianism I always thought being a vegan was a bit extreme and potentially quite unhealthy. But I’m beginning to realise it is the way forward for the future of the planet.

I think people eat for the taste and texture. I like the taste and texture of meat but I want to reduce my consumption for health and environmental reasons. If I can eat veggie pretend meat then, for me at least, it's a win win situation.

I was veggie for 15 years MOnica. I really enjoy meat. When I didn't eat it, I did it for ethical reasons. It tastes good. So I enjoyed eating meat replacements. So it is understandable to me when vegetarians eat meat replacement products.

I am sorry I remain bemused. If you have given up meat (or anything else) on a matter of principle, I would have thought that you would be even more unlikely to want to eat pretend versions of that which is to be avoided on principle. If you cannot eat it because of allergy reasons, it would be understandable.

In a word, savoury.