Are supermarkets controlling what we eat?

In no situation will everybody in every group be able to do everything. This is not an excuse for everyone in every group to do nothing.

Because those on the smallest incomes cannot shop around, do not have the income to make choices, does not excuse those who can for not making those choices. The median household in come in this country is £32,200. That means the middle value where 50% have a larger income and 50% have a smaller income.

If the 50% or more, who should be able to make the choices between a good diet or bad, who are likely to have the ability to choose not to shop in supermarkets, were to do so, the supermarkets would lose so much trade they would have to adjust to consumer demand, assuming that consuners didn't choose to put the price of their food above the quality.

The factor that has driven supermarket growth in this country is that for well over 100 years there has been a government policy of making sure food is as cheap as possible.

This policy in the late 1800s to 1940s destroyed our agriculture industry, drove farmers that managed to make a living to pursue crops with high productivity, grown on soils heavily chemically fertilised, using insecticides to control pests. or rearing animals in unnatural conditions on foods they digestions are not adapted to deal with and then pumping them full of antibiotics to deal with constant infection, and worst still giving them antibiotics to make them grow faster. It has led to a loss of diversity in animal breeds and crop varietys and in many area left us dependent on one or two seed varieties or animal types. It has devastated wildlife, reduced insect and baird populations and made a major contribution to global warming.

Reading GN it is very clear that what drives most people's food buying, even when it is not a question of income, is price, low is good high is better. Put quality before price and you are a middle class snob.

In the UK we spend a smaller proportion of our incomes on food than any other country in Europe, and only Australia and the US spend less on food than us world wide. Both countries renowned for industrial farming without regard to its environmental cost, nor its appalling animal welfare standards.

We can be grouped withthese two countries because our governments over many years have espoused chep food at all cost and the British public as a whole, have themselves been bred to put price before everything else when buying food.

In the 18th and early 19th century Britain was famous for the quality of its food. The British population was the best fed in Europe.

Since 1900 it has been famed for the dreadfulness of its food, its poor quality and tastelessness. One of the outstanding improvements emanating from having a large immigrant population has had is to raise our culinary standards. Unfortunately we mainly eat these new and interesting food products through ready meals where poor quality ingredients are enhanced by chemicals and E numbers. and to get these foreign dishes intheir true quality you have to find the restaurants that attract that countries own people.

I did not criticise frozen veg in any way. I agree that often they’re superior in many ways. But for me, not frozen green beans -too tinny!

Callistemon21

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

Sorry, but you’re wrong about runner beans ExperiencedNotOld. Frozen vegetables are at least as nutritious as fresh ones, there’s no waste and they don’t need preparation before use. They don’t taste as nice, and can be more expensive depending on what they are, but they are not unhealthy.

Not frozen - fresh vegetables ‘prepared’ for convenience. Available in all large supermarkets.

People with little money aren’t the ones buying fresh, ready prepared vegetable though, are they - those are for the cash rich, time poor. What’s most important is that people actually choose to eat vegetables instead of rubbish, surely?

What’s most important is that people actually choose to eat vegetables instead of rubbish, surely?

Yes!

So many judgemental posts on this thread.

So eat vitamin leached veg? When it takes a few minutes to prepare from whole?
Not judgmental, just a demonstration of people not understanding anything about the nutrition in food.

I buy frozen veg. As well as the usual suspects, I have Chantenay carrots for my GD as she only eats those ones, broad beans, edamame beans and butternut squash. Also frozen fruit such as mixed berries, which can quickly be made into a compote or used in a pie or other pudding.

On farming and low prices, a friend told me recently that someone in her family who owns a farm doesn’t actually produce anything from their land now, because profits are so low. They make their money from the diversification schemes they were encouraged to embrace, while the fields just sit there, unused. How sad!

Tesco rules

The supermarket here sells British beef, grass-fed beef and cheaper Irish beef (which was so tough I had to slow cook the remains of a roast joint).
There is a large choice of foodstuffs, from reasonably priced products to organic produce, fresh, frozen, processed, British and from overseas, so people can shop according to their preferences and financial situation.

They also donate surplus to the community fridge and have large cages for donations to the local Food Bank.

I don't like the pressure supermarkets put on farmers but they are providing a convenient service as most people don't have the time to go shopping in individual shops and markets.
I think if someone has the time to do that it should be encouraged but it's not always cheaper.

Vegetables are frozen almost as soon as they are harvested and therefore retain most of their nutrients.

Probably more than any that may have been lingering on shelves for a while.

Veg was always a sideshow when I was a child and I only ever ate it under threat of no pudding at school

My Dad grew veg and had an allotment, woe betide us if we didn't eat his veg!!

School dinners were another story.

Because I have mobility problems and am afraid of cooking vegetables on the hob and the straining of them I use a lot of frozen vegetables. Not only peas and beans but packs of stewing vegetables ready chopped onions , mashed potatoes etc. Vegetables are frozen almost as soon as they are harvested and therefore retain most of their nutrients.

That is capitalism, it eats itself up. The big supermarkets all copy each others’ ranges and some may be slightly superior in taste than others. There are I think many more choices of vegetables now than years ago and this is thanks to the different cultures and their cuisines.
Veg was always a sideshow when I was a child and I only ever ate it under threat of no pudding at school.
At home it was tinned peas (I still love marrow fat processed) tinned butter beans, broad beans tinned carrots and new fangled sweet corn in the week with fresh veg making an appearance on Sundays. We had lots of “real” fresh meat and fish though- as in not reformed or pre-formed or whatever it’s known as😋

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

Sorry, but you’re wrong about runner beans ExperiencedNotOld. Frozen vegetables are at least as nutritious as fresh ones, there’s no waste and they don’t need preparation before use. They don’t taste as nice, and can be more expensive depending on what they are, but they are not unhealthy.

Not frozen - fresh vegetables ‘prepared’ for convenience. Available in all large supermarkets.

People with little money aren’t the ones buying fresh, ready prepared vegetable though, are they - those are for the cash rich, time poor. What’s most important is that people actually choose to eat vegetables instead of rubbish, surely?

What’s most important is that people actually choose to eat vegetables instead of rubbish, surely?

Yes!

So many judgemental posts on this thread.

I'd buy chopped up swede, butternut squash if I was on my own because they're just too hard to peel and chop.

ExperiencedNotOld

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

Sorry, but you’re wrong about runner beans ExperiencedNotOld. Frozen vegetables are at least as nutritious as fresh ones, there’s no waste and they don’t need preparation before use. They don’t taste as nice, and can be more expensive depending on what they are, but they are not unhealthy.

Not frozen - fresh vegetables ‘prepared’ for convenience. Available in all large supermarkets.

People with little money aren’t the ones buying fresh, ready prepared vegetable though, are they - those are for the cash rich, time poor. What’s most important is that people actually choose to eat vegetables instead of rubbish, surely?

Connect above
www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/301194326

Casdon

ExperiencedNotOld

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

Sorry, but you’re wrong about runner beans ExperiencedNotOld. Frozen vegetables are at least as nutritious as fresh ones, there’s no waste and they don’t need preparation before use. They don’t taste as nice, and can be more expensive depending on what they are, but they are not unhealthy.

Not frozen - fresh vegetables ‘prepared’ for convenience. Available in all large supermarkets.

ExperiencedNotOld

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

Sorry, but you’re wrong about runner beans ExperiencedNotOld. Frozen vegetables are at least as nutritious as fresh ones, there’s no waste and they don’t need preparation before use. They don’t taste as nice, and can be more expensive depending on what they are, but they are not unhealthy.

Supermarkets only sell the less-than-wholesome because lazy people will buy it. Pre-sliced runner beans is an example. Open the pack, dump in the pain, let’s not worry about the leach of vitamins occurring since it was packed - all for something that’d take minutes. However, few receive a proper food education nowadays. I did cookery, I was taught nutrition and learnt meal planning, all before O level. Now you’re lucky to bake a few fairy cakes! My daughter did GCSE 12 years ago and cooked little and didn’t seem to learn much worthwhile. But she eats very well, as both her and her partner have made the effort to learn about producing nutritious food. If a policeman and a paramedic often on opposite shifts can do it, I’m sure anyone can.

It's not straightforward is it? If you have money to spend it's still possible to buy good quality food but if you are on a more limited budget and are tight for time it is much more difficult. I'm very lucky I get a lot of my meat from local farmers some is quite expensive but I get eggs and pork at cost, a lamb for the freezer given to me as quid pro quo. A neighbour who shoots keeps me in venison, pheasant and pigeon breasts foc, I just have to ask. What I notice when I buy supermarket meat is it's very cheap but it leaks liquid when you cook it, basically pumped with water and lacks proper flavour but in the past I've had to manage my money very carefully and would have been glad to buy it. Supermarkets do control what is produced, they want cheap as possible and animals of the right size for their portioning. We love Dexter beef but you'll never see it in a supermarket as it's a very small beast and not viable commercially despite that it's hardy, will thrive on poor grazing and is brilliant for conservation purpose. Cheap food is Cheap for a reason but not everyone can afford better.

SusieB50

I live in the London suburbs. I have the choice of Tesco Sainsbury’s Waitrose M&S and Co-op within 2 miles of each other . Within the last 3 years a butcher , 2 bakeries and 2 greengrocers have reopened in the area . They all seem to do well . I generally have a delivery as I don’t drive but do do top up shopping at the independent shops . But my supermarket shop only consists unprocessed foods and UK meat and dairy . I think it’s appalling that a litre of milk costs less then some bottles of pop . We will lose all our dairy producers if they are not paid properly by the supermarkets .

SusieB50, We will lose all our dairy producers if they are not paid properly by the supermarkets.

Indeed. Apply that to all farmers and what they produce!

MawtheMerrier

^One big shop a month with small top ups each week and no midweek shopping. Every three months visit the butcher to restock the freezer. I spent less time than most shopping It requires organisation to shop as I did/do. but that is all. It is only a hassle if you make it such^ .

M0nica, it also requires a car , a * freezer*, a job which allows you a lunch hour (that rules out shift workers, teachers, nurses, bus drivers, warehouse workers among others) and an income which permits monthly “big shops” - and possibly a partner to help with the child care or driving.
I feel I must be living in a parallel universe, volunteering at a food bank where young (usually) mums- often with small children, the unwaged and those on minimum wage or zero hours contracts or also pensioners on their OAP do not enjoy those luxuries.
When your children were babies Monica I bet there was a regular bus service too- not always the case these days!
There are a million reasons why we as consumers are not all free to shop around or make healthy and economical choices.
None of that negates the stranglehold our supermarkets have on the vast majority of consumers . Perhaps we have played into their hands and things might have been different but I doubt it.

Indeed.

A car, a freezer, a home to accommodate a freezer, a lunch hour, decent income to rely on - not common for all.

And I think growstuff the message that shopping is some form of hobby is particularly aimed at women.

It seems as though the small independent greengrocers are getting plenty of fruit and veg stock. The one I go to was laden with everything as normal this morning. It is pricier than run of the mill supermarkets and probably they pay higher prices to the wholesalers and hence to the growers

Same also with my organic box, which has always been more expensive. I do believe that we are seeing the end of cheap bargain basement food. Trouble is that it has happened all at once and people have not had time to come to terms with it

Galaxy

I think it's also something to do with the message that shopping is some sort of hobby, it's not it's a chore, trekking round a variety of shops with children sounds not a great way to me to spend time, if you are lucky enough to have the financial resources there are many other things I would prefer to be doing.

I couldn't agree more. It's a chore.

Maw I think I live in the same universe as you.

Nevertheless, I would disagree that choices from supermarkets can't be healthy and economic. I used to make a point of buying my meat from a local butcher/farmer, but I can't afford it any more, so I buy supermarket meat, but not very much of it. I also used to grow my own veg, but I can't do that any more and restrict myself to grow again salad leaves and courgettes. I have a friend who is a commercial grower, who gives me boxes of in season veg, but I still have to buy from the supermarket. I eat very healthily and as economically as I can (although the increase in the price of basics is hard). I also use a local FoodShare scheme, which has saved me loads.

I hardly ever go into a supermarket, but it's not difficult to walk past the aisles of crisps, cereals, bread, pasta, pizzas, cakes and all the other stuff I don't eat.

I live in the London suburbs. I have the choice of Tesco Sainsbury’s Waitrose M&S and Co-op within 2 miles of each other . Within the last 3 years a butcher , 2 bakeries and 2 greengrocers have reopened in the area . They all seem to do well . I generally have a delivery as I don’t drive but do do top up shopping at the independent shops . But my supermarket shop only consists unprocessed foods and UK meat and dairy . I think it’s appalling that a litre of milk costs less then some bottles of pop . We will lose all our dairy producers if they are not paid properly by the supermarkets .

One big shop a month with small top ups each week and no midweek shopping. Every three months visit the butcher to restock the freezer. I spent less time than most shopping It requires organisation to shop as I did/do. but that is all. It is only a hassle if you make it such .

M0nica, it also requires a car , a * freezer*, a job which allows you a lunch hour (that rules out shift workers, teachers, nurses, bus drivers, warehouse workers among others) and an income which permits monthly “big shops” - and possibly a partner to help with the child care or driving.
I feel I must be living in a parallel universe, volunteering at a food bank where young (usually) mums- often with small children, the unwaged and those on minimum wage or zero hours contracts or also pensioners on their OAP do not enjoy those luxuries.
When your children were babies Monica I bet there was a regular bus service too- not always the case these days!
There are a million reasons why we as consumers are not all free to shop around or make healthy and economical choices.
None of that negates the stranglehold our supermarkets have on the vast majority of consumers . Perhaps we have played into their hands and things might have been different but I doubt it.