retirement and early death

www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18952037

A useful article albeit dating from 2012 since which time life expectancy figures have apparently improved.
I particularly like the paragraph early on which says that some statistics if repeated often enough can become regarded as truth even if they have no historical foundation.
If average life expectancy is now something like 80, how can we extrapolate a statistic that says average lif expectancy for those who retire at 60 is 18 years, but only 18 months for those who retire at 65? It doesn't add up, given that an awful lot of people do retire at that age because their pension (state or private) may not be payable at a lower age without losing value. According to actuarial calculations the last years before retirement can make the greatest difference to one's pension.
There is also a reference to certain professions towards the end of the article -well worth a minute or two of your time!

*But we all know of many people who are reluctant to go to their doctor, but will listen to a group of people who they trust who are advising them

Well I think that is an appalling prospect*

Doesnt stop it being true though.

*Well I think that is an appalling prospect and for someone who on their own admission has no relevant qualifications, and I do not just mean in the professional sense, to give advice about retirement and health issues is downright irresponsible! You say;

I happen to be in a position where some people would somewhat, in a small way, listen to me. But I am unsure what advice exactly to give

That's easy then, DON'T!!!*

But we all do it every day dont we?
It is called every day conversation.
They do know that I am not a doctor!

The figures are there ( all EU countries know it) that, the earlier you retire, the longer you will live. This study was done in the 80s when they were looking at lowering the retirement age.

Ooh. Thank you. I didnt know that.
I will try and google it.

You could end up with no staff if you intend advising everyone to retire as early as they can, soontobe!

"Lawyers, accountants and so on are a group [in the ONS * data] called 'higher managerial and professional'," says Grimshaw ( an actuary quoted in the article, and actuaries are the people who work out pensions, life insurance etc based on figures such as life expectancy). "They would have life expectancy of nearly 19 years for males at age 65. At the other end of the scale, you would have occupations such as labourers and cleaners, where life expectancy at 65 is nearer 15 years."
(* Office of National Statistics )

Read this soontobe and at least any advice you are tempted to give might have some foundation in fact rather than urban myth.

So Petra how do explain the fact that retirement ages have in fact gone up and not down ??
By your argument the government wants us all to die young!!
Come to think of it . . . .

The 80's were 30- 40 years ago, and there have been significant improvements in the average life expectancy for men, although not to the same extent for women Smoking and drinking, alas, playing a part.!

Health and life expectancy have improved a lot since the 1980s
Doctors and dentists are notoriously unhealthy bunch janeainsworth compared to other professionals ( i believe) So we should not generalise from them. including high suicide rates (they know how to do the deed)
Teachers these days are in the privileged position that they can reduce their hours in the last few years of work, without reducing their pension (their final salary scheme based on highest earnings rather than final earnings.) That is probably the ideal.

Having now entered the realms of googling and statistics Alea, I also found this one
blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/ianmcowie/100021203/delay-retirement-and-live-longer-experts-say-but-dead-comedian-disagreed/

My head is beginning to spin!

Some years ago I knew a number of people, all men, who died within a year of retirement. They all seemed to be men whose job had been the only focus in their lives, no hobbies, no outside interests, nothing. Once they retired their whole purpose for living was gone.

It happened several times in the company DH worked for and DH had an interesting conversation with another colleague who was nearing retirement and saw the link and was asking DH about his out of work interests (which are many and various)and how to develop some of his own.

I have also had a number of friends and acquaintances who have died before their 70th birthday, nearly all had longstanding health problems, or habits (smoking) that put them at risk of fatal illnesses.

Only just read this thread, and I must say in spite of serious question, the early comments by Jingle and Roses had me laughing out loud. Just my strange sense of humour! Made me feel happier

Your first paragraph especially M0nica, is ringing bells.

For those of us who are still married,and DH is either retired, semi-retired or still working, I recommend having a ' full marriage' like the Carsons! This will either keep you both enjoying life, or go out with a bang.

I followed up your link soontobe and thought this bit extremely interesting, it seems to contradict the idea that earlier retirement is automatically a good thing.
If the thought of an extra decade at work is just too much, then another interesting aspect of research by Steven Baxter of Club Vita is that much shorter periods of work can also significantly improve life expectancy. For example, men who retire at 65 rather than 60 live an average of 7.5 months longer, while women who delay retirement by the same period live an extra 6.5 months

Statistics can be very misleading as they can "put the cart before the horse".
If you can afford to retire early chances are you are better off, in a job with a pension so you do not have to wait for your state pension, your job may be less physically taxing than a bricklayer, steelworker or labourer (even allowing for stress)and in so many ways the odds are on your side , probably better nutrition, health care and an awareness of the influence of lfestyle choices. So, provided you are also lucky (and don't get knocked down by a bus) you do stand a better chance of living to a ripe old age.

Soontobe he was a GP- the statistics were from the actuarial life insurance companies statistics.

Thank you Alea.
I agree with you.

From the BBC article:
A paper attributed to the aircraft-maker Boeing shows that employees who retire at 55 live to, on average, 83. But those who retire at 65 only last, on average, another 18 months.
The "Boeing study" has been quoted by newspapers, magazines and pundits. It's circulated on the internet for years. The problem with it is that Boeing itself says it's simply not true
Putting Boeing to one side, then, is there any other evidence which might support the idea that retiring early prolongs life? Surprisingly, perhaps, the truth may be the precise opposite: the later you retire, the longer you live

Epidemiologists at the oil firm Shell carried out a study of past employees in the US, which found that mortality was slightly earlier - on average - for staff who retired at 55, than for those who continued working to 65

It does rather look as if you can prove anything by statistics, the problem is that the Boeing "statistics" would appear to be not only anecdotal, but fallacious.
But if people say it often enough, somebody (probably on Facebook) will attempt to convince everybody that is true.
Remember, there are 3 kinds of lies - "Lies, damn lies and statistics"

As someone who has worked on statistics, statistics are fine if you know where they came from and how they were gathered, but newspapers and individuals will quote statistics out of context.

I think some people who retire early do so for medical reasons, which would suggest that their life expectancy was limited when they retired. Possibly those working to 65 are healthier. Several friends and acquaintances retired under the age of 65 for medical reasons and, sadly, all died around the age of 70

Excellent point MOnica

I can only talk for teachers but the general rule is that the earlier you retire the longer you'll have left! Retired teachers always look about ten years younger after the first six month detoxing. Go for it! I retired at 55 three years ago and I haven't looked back. I might be a bit poorer but I feel like a new person.

I had to take early retirement at 54 years of age to spend 24 years as a full time Carer, at the time for £39 per week. Touch wood I have had a very good run healthwise with no problems at all and am now 81, still fit and healthy although on my own now. I had a stressful job plus nothing as lonely or stressful as being thrust into Caring and watch a loved one fall apart before your eyes.

DH lecturer, me, nurse both retired at 60 and have had 20 years of enjoyable retirement. We are so fortunate

There is a statistical phenomenon where events appear to be more common than they actually are because we focus on certain categories of event - in this case early death after retirement.
If you sit and think hard and count up the cases of people you know who have retired and NOT died soon after it puts it in perspective.
Also, truly random events do tend to occur in clusters, so if you say there is an average of one car accident per month at particular junction, this can mean there are three accidents in one month then none for several months, but it's still, on average, one accident per month.
So you might get several deaths soon after retirement in a short space of time, but then none for ages.

I also agree with the point made by Monica - that sometimes people take early retirement due to ill health and therefore die early due to their illness - but not everyone necessarily knows they are retiring because they are unwell.