Princess Grace hospital cancelled vital surgery for woman who requested single-sex care

VS I understand your deciding against it. In your position I would make the same decision, for the same reasons given by Smileless2012.

We don't have to pretend it didn't happen VS because it didn't. Why don't you give just one example to show that it did?

VioletSky

I have actually decided against it because highlighting all the comments where it is said that some trans people make all trans people look bad...

Feels like it would be a bit personal

Besides, you all read them and I remember who disagreed and who ignored it because let's pretend that didn't happen

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Anyway topic is corrupted, it got nasty and imma hide it now so I don't see my name on the "I'm on" wossname cos I'm nosy lol

I have actually decided against it because highlighting all the comments where it is said that some trans people make all trans people look bad...

Feels like it would be a bit personal

Besides, you all read them and I remember who disagreed and who ignored it because let's pretend that didn't happen

Yes please VS quoting the examples would be good.

VioletSky

Lol

Re read the thread more objectively

Self reflection and personal growth is a wonderful thing

Your posts are becoming a series of aphorisms, VS . Have you been reading the works of Confucius or something?

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202211/medium-675314-screenshot-20221103-142821-chrome.jpg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202211/medium-496169-screenshot-20221103-142821-chrome.jpg

This has happened on this thread

Do I need to quote the examples?

Yes Doodledog the snide digs are very tiresome and are obviously not based on fact or those making them would be able to point to specific examples.

I take it that you no longer consider it necessary for anyone who believes trans are valid to leave this thread VS. As someone who does, I'm glad I decided to stay.

Lol

Re read the thread more objectively

Self reflection and personal growth is a wonderful thing

Glorianny

There are non so blind as those who will not see.

I'm feeling quite classical and literary today!

If that is another snide dig, please elaborate. If not, please say so. These slurs get tiresome, particularly when they are generalised so that nobody is sure whether they are being targeted or not. And please - no 'if the cap fits' nonsense? As you pointed out recently, that would come under the 'Cat's Eye' style of bullying.

There are non so blind as those who will not see.

I'm feeling quite classical and literary today!

I haven't seen any trans discrimination here.

Glorianny

VioletSky 'twas ever thus on these threads.
Trans discrimination must not be compared with any other forms of discrimination, because the people who advocate it are, of course, not discriminating!

As far as the Jewish faith is concerned there are many different types and customs. I wonder if anyone can answer this. I understand that Orthodox Rabbis conventionally do not touch women they do not know. So if one is taken into hospital does he have to ask for all male nurses? Or is it possible to suspend the rule?

Why are we talking about Jewish people? These diversions are tedious in the extreme.

Saying that there is no link between anti-semitism and questioning the practices of TRAs is simply the truth, and nothing to do with your insinuation that I am discriminatory.

Please point to where I have suggested that I discriminate against transpeople, as I find this suggestion offensive and would like to be able to address any misunderstandings if they have occurred.

I've said I wont leave VS. Surprised that you haven't bearing in mind your suggestion that anyone who believes trans are valid, should do.

Smileless2012

*No one* has suggested never mind stated that trans people are not valid and I for one will not be leaving this thread to give that any credibility.

No no

Please stay lol

No one has suggested never mind stated that trans people are not valid and I for one will not be leaving this thread to give that any credibility.

I suggest you ask your question on a new thread Glorianny as it has nothing to do with this thread and could be seen as an attempt at derailing.

When posters suggest that some TRAs spoil things for other transpeople it is those like your niece that they are referring to and supporting - people who harm nobody and just go about their lives in a way that makes them happy. They would have a much better chance of being supported in that aim if not for others who want to cheat at sport, enter female spaces, change the language and skew research data so that sex-based disparities are hidden, and crime figures are meaningless where sex-based differences are concerned.

So it would be nice if law, and policy in all organisations such as this private hospital, were clear about the meanings of words e.g. what is meant by the word 'female'.

VioletSky 'twas ever thus on these threads.
Trans discrimination must not be compared with any other forms of discrimination, because the people who advocate it are, of course, not discriminating!

As far as the Jewish faith is concerned there are many different types and customs. I wonder if anyone can answer this. I understand that Orthodox Rabbis conventionally do not touch women they do not know. So if one is taken into hospital does he have to ask for all male nurses? Or is it possible to suspend the rule?

I agree Prentice and posted yesterday that bringing race and/or religion into the discussion muddies the water as this issue has nothing to do with either.

The only reason I can see for introducing Jewish people, Muslim women or any other group other than the trans lobby is to try and underpin a weak argument.

It's been said time and time again that the concerns raised here and on other threads dealing with this issue, are for the loss of women's spaces, the potential of women being at risk when this is the case, the ridiculous alternatives to the word woman being used such as breast feeders, people who bleed etc and the issue raised in this discussion specifically, the concern that a woman requesting female only care may not be informed if one of her carers is trans regardless of how that carer looks.

It is about discrimination about certain groups, and association. My friends will never deny that they are Jewish, but they clearly want to dissociate themselves from what is happening in Israel, and about the dreadful discrimination and crimes being perpetrated in the name of their religion., and Zionism.

Prentice

I think it best to leave Jewish people out of it, or indeed any other group other than the trans lobby.

Agreed. But when it was brought in it needed to be challenged.

Fleurpepper

''The difference is thaat Jewish people (or any other of the less contentious groups who have been hastily dragged in to make the first attempt seem less offensive) are not asking for a shift in people's perceptions so that they can claim to be something they aren't.'' it depends when and where''. I have Jewish friends who have moved away from Israel, as they just cannot be or be part of, in any way, shape or form, what Jews are doing to Palestinians right now and for a very long time. And using their faith to do so. Fact.

What has that got to do with the thread, FP?

I'm sorry - I don't mean to keep picking you up on points like this, as I do get the impression that you are posting in good faith; but the point of my post is that there is no link between anti-semitism and the questioning of TRA's insistence on changing society to suit them. Jews did not insist on any of the things I mentioned, so discrimination against them was based on unfounded prejudice. Objecting to such insistence is not the same thing at all, which is what volver wanted to suggest upthread.

In an ideal world, people like your Jewish friends, your trans friends and your anti-Apartheid friends would live in peace, and nobody on this thread is saying that they were wrong or had any dubious motives. But there are some Trans Rights Activists who are not like them, and who are violently oppressing women who object to what we see as our erasure, and it is these people who are being referred to on this thread.

When posters suggest that some TRAs spoil things for other transpeople it is those like your niece that they are referring to and supporting - people who harm nobody and just go about their lives in a way that makes them happy. They would have a much better chance of being supported in that aim if not for others who want to cheat at sport, enter female spaces, change the language and skew research data so that sex-based disparities are hidden, and crime figures are meaningless where sex-based differences are concerned.

To anyone who believes trans people are valid

I'd really recommend leaving this thread. Sometimes it's better to leave others shouting into the void without providing a punch bag.

The original topic has been corrupted completely