Bonkers new rule at our GP surgery

MaddyOne, in case you were directing your comments to me, I was not, and have never been a 'GP basher'. I was merely reporting on a new rather weird system of trying to book an appointment, and if you read my posts you will understand that.

Dandylion

I think they model themselves on Dickens' Circumlocution Office.... round and round getting nowhere... I had a letter from our Surgery to book a Hypertension review... Went to desk with letter. 'Can you prove your address?' I was asked. - Showed letter from them to me at my address with request to come in. No, they said - it has to be a bill for gas, electricity or rates! 'But here I am standing in front of you so I must have received your letter at where I live' I said. They wouldn't accept it. So I left feeling like a non-person, with my Hypertension at top rate and without the review!

Are you not signed up for Patient Access with your GP? Apart from when I first signed up for it, I have never once been asked for proof of my address.

I used to get upcoming hospital appointments showing, then they would disappear once I'd been.

They also had a date, by which time, if I hadn't heard, I could phone the dept. (And leave 55 messages, hoping to hear back!)

Which system was that? It's not the one which my GP uses, which has never had hospital appointments.

It sounds like something local to your area.

MissAdventure

I don't believe gps have a moral obligation to work themselves into the ground.

If times have changed, and both gps and patients (some) are finding things are no longer workable, then a solution needs to be found.

Since I'm pretty sure we all want the same results, that's at least a starting point.

Good post MissA.

MissAdventure

I don't believe gps have a moral obligation to work themselves into the ground.

If times have changed, and both gps and patients (some) are finding things are no longer workable, then a solution needs to be found.

Since I'm pretty sure we all want the same results, that's at least a starting point.

Oh I could not agree more. But it was the way it was, not that long ago. And projection figures were based on GPs working much longer hours, and full time. Hence the massive shortage.

I would certainly not advocate a return to this dangerous madness, dangerous for all! We as a couple and later as a family lived it, day in, night out- it nearly killed my OH twice, and he harldy saw his kids grow up. It also tied me at home, night and day, answering the phone and dealing with emergencies (wihtout any qualifications whatsoever) - as GP in those days could not operate without a partner or spouse prepared to do this.

But the shortages we have now are partly due to this.

Fleurpepper I don’t disbelieve you, but when did this happen? Not for donkeys years, because it’s no longer possible. There are far more patients, more complex treatments, and too few doctors. I’m pleased to hear that you approve of doctors working extremely long hours and doing night visits (not sure what 111 is for in that case, but never mind that) but for myself, I would prefer a doctor who is fresh from a good nights sleep. I don’t want to go backwards in the health service, I want to move forward to a better and more efficient health service, not back to one grounded in the 1950s.
Why did you think laws were passed to make junior doctors not able to work such long hours? I’ll tell you, it’s because rested doctors don’t make mistakes in the way that tired doctors do. I think that’s progress, obviously you don’t.

Fleurpepper you were obviously married to a GP. Do you really think the way your husband worked was better for his patients, himself, his wife or his children? Why do you want to go backwards?

It does appear that patients are using a variety of methods to get in touch with their GP or practice. Some patients appear to get satisfaction from the way their surgery operates and others less so. I’m at a loss myself to understand why the NHS App isn’t available and able to deliver for all patients as it does for me.

You just don't get what I am saying. I am with you all the way- it was barbaric and dangerous. And it was right through the 70s and 80s and 90s, until new contracts were put in place which allowed GPs to opt out of night and weekends.

What I am saying, is that ever since that new contract- we have had a massive shortage of GPs. Even beyond those dates, calculations were made on full time GPs, working much longer hours. Of course it was dangerous for all concerned. If you got to Casualty at 3am, when the Junior doctor on calle was on his 130+ hrs- he or she was like a zombie! Agreed 100%.

I remember nights on call at home with 3, 4, 5 calls, often a long way away- no-ong got any sleep, and in the morning, the GP got up and went to work, for a full 10+ day. Sheer madness.

But, if GPs now do not cover nights and week-ends, work much shorter hours, see fewer patients- and on top of that- go part-time, the knock on effect on shortages is huge.

Not having a GP, or getting an ambulance or a bed, is not very safe, at all.

Ever since 2004

GPs plan to 'opt out' of night duty

MORE than eight out of 10 GPs are planning to opt out of providing care for patients outside surgery hours, according to a survey. Eighty-three per cent of GPs say they will ditch night and weekend cover when a new contract is introduced in April.

Nowadays, it is 100% who opt out- putting huge pressure on ambulance services and Emergency services, and requiring lots of other doctors to cover thos hours separately.

Are there locum doctors who would cover weekends?

Surely, there must be?

I’m sorry if I misunderstood you Fleurpepper.
As we now have 111 and GPs do work at night and weekends, I can’t see how there is no provision though. My son in law, before he went to New Zealand, worked as a GP at his practice during the week, but did many extra shifts both at night and at weekends. Sometimes he was just talking to patients and then prescribing for them to pick up at the duty chemist, sometimes he advised them to go to hospital, sometimes he did a home visits shift where he had a driver who drove him to patients houses and he did a home visit. This is why I don’t understand why anyone thinks we should go back to individual GPs doing all home visits. The provision is there, and when I had Covid, it most likely saved my life.

I hope my previous comment answered your query MissA.

My daughter, who has three young children, would be unable to do any night shifts when her husband was out doing his night shifts. But she can work in the practice during the day.

Yes, thanks, Maddy.
It's very complex, it seems, with multiple layers but to an everyday person (me!) it's as if gps just were wiped off the face of the earth.

Although we have been able to see our Drs for most of the time apart from lockdown periods France is experiencing similar problems in recruiting GPs. In rural areas some communes are offering inducements for doctors to work there. Free housing for example. Our surgeries don't hold clinics or have nurses there but we are able to see the Dr generally within a couple of days of ringing up. We pay 25 euros per visit but part of that is refunded.

maddyone

I’m sorry if I misunderstood you Fleurpepper.
As we now have 111 and GPs do work at night and weekends, I can’t see how there is no provision though. My son in law, before he went to New Zealand, worked as a GP at his practice during the week, but did many extra shifts both at night and at weekends. Sometimes he was just talking to patients and then prescribing for them to pick up at the duty chemist, sometimes he advised them to go to hospital, sometimes he did a home visits shift where he had a driver who drove him to patients houses and he did a home visit. This is why I don’t understand why anyone thinks we should go back to individual GPs doing all home visits. The provision is there, and when I had Covid, it most likely saved my life.

I am NO saying they should go back to those crazy times- NOT at all.

Those who cover nights and week-ends are totally separate from the GP services. What I am saying, is that it has a huge repercussion on the shortage of GPs and other doctors.

Agree MissA.

Then I actually think we agree Fleurpepper.
Of course 111 is separate from the surgeries, but often it is the same doctors who do both, like my son in law.

I do understand GPs are too few to do all they are supposed to do, and that GPs have had to empower their practise managers to make rules that sort through what patients' needs are.

What I don't understand is why practises (which are now run as businesses) don't employ more of the relatively low-paid receptionists so any patient can at least speak to a human being not a recorded message or a line engaged signal.

Caleo Because NHS England has decreed that practices should adopt total triage and online systems.

GP receptionists will be a job role of the past. In my practice, they're not even called receptionists any more (I've forgotten their fancy new job title). Allegedly, they've all had training to direct people to the most appropriate clinician. However, they're being phased out and replaced by an online system, although one or two will be retained for people who can't access the online system. In theory, the online system could be monitored by somebody anywhere in the world.

Growstuff, thanks for informing me. I wonder if Rishi Sunak knows the online system is not working.