Did you watch Panorama last night?

Sorry Monica crossed posts.

Primrose
There’s no disagreement that smoking is extremely bad for one’s health but many have put forward the argument that their aunt/uncle/whoever smoked 40 a day and lived to be 95. The overwhelming evidence is to the contrary.

Primrose you are simply telling us how your parents ate and when they died. Other people will tell us how their father smoked 20 cigarettes a day from the age of 15 until he died aged 110.

One off anecdotes like this tell us nothing, merely what happened in your family. They only take meaning when there samples of many, many families all showing the same thing. If we look back we can see that 50 years agoon average people died much younger than they do now and died of completely different illnesses.

I have already said that I think much obesity is linked with people having far more money to spend on eating. In the past people struggled to get enough food, now we are looking at a situation that has not existed before, of millions, billions of people able to eat as much as they like, so they do. Fine when human kind could go from feast to famine at different times of the year, but now it is all feast with no famine to balance it.

However, I do see where UPF's play into this - and quite simply, back in the 1970s/80s, I looked at all the chemicals in food and worried about what effect these multitudes of chemicals in our bodies interacting with each other might have, and decided to eat as simply and as close to basic foodstuffs as possible and feed my family that way.

I am not going to use anecdotal evidence to 'prove' i did the right thing. just say i do not regret my decisions, knowing what i know now.

I had no idea about the rapeseed oil and am very grateful for the information indeed.
I changed to oat drinks to avoid milk as changing HAS improved my IBS stuff.

It’s a shame as the Modern Milkman delivers to my door every week and saves heaving it around shopping. Wondering if all oat milk has rapeseed oil in. ( btw I shall email them, as they are all ‘we’re into environmentally right on’ stuff.

No, not because your opinion differs from mine, but because other than personal anecdote you haven’t provided any evidence that ultra processed food is not detrimental to health, whereas there is a body of evidence to say it is?

Casdon

Primrose53

tickingbird

Primrose Yes but your parents were cooking from scratch and wouldn’t have been eating very much Ultra processed food. That’s the difference.

I said they were “brought up on” foods like suet, yorkshires etc so in my parents case by the time they were starting a family in their mid twenties, there was more money around after the war years and rationing.

Very slowly, there was more choice too! They were eating stuff like sausages, ham, cakes, trifles, crisps etc. all of which would now be called UPF.

Fast forward a decade or so and sugary breakfast cereals were available, salad creams, sauces, Angel Delight, fruity yoghourts and ice cream were all the rage which us kids loved. In my teenage years we pestered Mum to get us Boil in the Bag delights like Vesta Curry and Paella. Yuk, yuk, yuk but it was a novelty.

So over their lives my parents went through many phases of eating and when they retired their biggest treat was going out for a drive with their trays and cutlery, buying fish and chips and eating it on the seafront.

My Dad never saw a doctor until he was 80 and like I said in my other post they both had a very sweet tooth!

I think this UPF business is just the current thing to get worked up about but it isn’t going to get me worked up! 🤣🤣

I can’t help thinking you’ve missed the point Primrose53, our parents generation were little affected, ours more so, and our children and grandchildren, on average exponentially more so.
The Institute of Economic Affairs have a huge vested interest in us eating the cheapest food available, so they are bound to be concerned about any programme that tells us not to eat highly processed food because it’s bad for us. I don’t see how anybody could think it does no harm.

So because my opinion differs from yours, I am missing the point!! 😝

I say, like my parents, eat what you like in moderation, don’t worry, be happy or they’ll have us all eating nothing but grass!

And remember those who push all this scaremongering at us will be making money writing books, promoting diets, doing DVDs etc.

www.broseoats.com/

Oh M0nica that is so disappointing. I love oat milk and thought at least it wasn't grown at the expense of rain forest or other irreplaceable resource.
What about brose which is sold in our storehouse?

Wyllow3

I'd swapped milk for oat milk delivered by Modern milkman to the door.

her's the ingredients

"Water, OATS, rapeseed oil, calcium carbonate, dipotassium phosphate (acidity regulator), salt and vitamins (D3, B2, B12, and potassium iodide)...

Where's the "baddie" there?

Wyllow3 you ask what is the 'baddie ' in your oat milk, it is in fact the rapeseed oil

Such a simple phrase that speaks of oil pressed from rape seed and use to make oat milk.

In fact rapeseed oil used in food manufacture is obtained using a chemical extraction method that involves an intense process where the rapeseed oil is extracted from the seeds under high temperatures, then it is bleached and deodorised, using chemicals, to create a flavourless and colourless oil. It results, of course, in more oil, per ton of rape seed than cold pressing does. The refined rapeseed oil used in food manufacturing is a classic example of a UPF.

This is the problem with UPF's often they are hidden behind the innocuous names of products, like 'rapeseed oil' and there is nothing on the packet to suggest that this product has actually gone through many industrialised processes involving countless noxious chemicals that change the nature of the oil before being used to make oat milk.

Grammaretto

That's great Claretjan I popped in too and met a young mum who thought there were only charity shops here. She bought lots from the refillery

The cafe is great too. Mr CJ and I both love the coffee and home baking!

I did hear someone say that UPFs contain the sort of ingredients you’d never find in your own kitchen.
And presumably, certainly not in your mother’s kitchen.

Wyllow3

I'd swapped milk for oat milk delivered by Modern milkman to the door.

her's the ingredients

"Water, OATS, rapeseed oil, calcium carbonate, dipotassium phosphate (acidity regulator), salt and vitamins (D3, B2, B12, and potassium iodide)...

Where's the "baddie" there?

Internet: "Dipotassium Phosphate- “fairly safe” Nov 4, 2020"

"Dipotassium phosphate is an ingredient you’ll find in many boxed milks that gets little attention.

Sure, maybe it’s not as bad as Canola Oil or Glyphosate (at least for now) but it still doesn’t belong in something marketed as healthy. Dipotassium phosphate is a chemical compound commercially made by combining phosphate, phosphorus, and sodium.

This results in a white powdery substance that easily dissolves in liquid and can be used as a fertilizer, food additive, or buffering agent.

It’s used as an emulsifier, stabilizer, and texturizer. And in oat milk, specifically, it’s used as an acidity regulator to help the oat milk interact with coffee and also allow it to steam better.

It’s a man-made chemical substance. It has ZERO health benefits and overconsumption can actually lead to serious kidney issues."

Omitting chemicals is why many people make their own oat milk.

Wyllow3

I'd swapped milk for oat milk delivered by Modern milkman to the door.

her's the ingredients

"Water, OATS, rapeseed oil, calcium carbonate, dipotassium phosphate (acidity regulator), salt and vitamins (D3, B2, B12, and potassium iodide)...

Where's the "baddie" there?

It's not the baddies, but the processing which makes it ultra-processed.

I'm actually pointing out that not all UVFs are bad.

Incidentally, dipotassium phosphate is bad for people with kidney disease, severe heart and lung disease, and thyroid problems and used as a buffering agent in antifreeze.

That's great Claretjan I popped in too and met a young mum who thought there were only charity shops here. She bought lots from the refillery

Granmarderby10

It is the ultra aspect that is the villain of the peace

I agree with you. UVFs aren't toxic substances put into food; the "ultra" means it's been processed so that nutrients have been destroyed and substances such as salt and emulsifiers have been added to give texture, just as home cooks thicken sauces. The problem is that people don't know they've been added and they increase the carb content of food, sometimes quite drastically.

High fructose corn syrup (HFCS), which isn't an emulsifier, is commonly added to all sorts of manufactured goods, particularly in the US and Canada as a natural sweetener as it's cheaper than sugar. It's been implicated in the increase of obesity, heart disease, T2 diabetes and digestive problems.

Casdon

The Institute of Economic Affairs have a huge vested interest in us eating the cheapest food available, so they are bound to be concerned about any programme that tells us not to eat highly processed food because it’s bad for us. I don’t see how anybody could think it does no harm.

Precisely.

I'd swapped milk for oat milk delivered by Modern milkman to the door.

her's the ingredients

"Water, OATS, rapeseed oil, calcium carbonate, dipotassium phosphate (acidity regulator), salt and vitamins (D3, B2, B12, and potassium iodide)...

Where's the "baddie" there?

Primrose53

tickingbird

Primrose Yes but your parents were cooking from scratch and wouldn’t have been eating very much Ultra processed food. That’s the difference.

I said they were “brought up on” foods like suet, yorkshires etc so in my parents case by the time they were starting a family in their mid twenties, there was more money around after the war years and rationing.

Very slowly, there was more choice too! They were eating stuff like sausages, ham, cakes, trifles, crisps etc. all of which would now be called UPF.

Fast forward a decade or so and sugary breakfast cereals were available, salad creams, sauces, Angel Delight, fruity yoghourts and ice cream were all the rage which us kids loved. In my teenage years we pestered Mum to get us Boil in the Bag delights like Vesta Curry and Paella. Yuk, yuk, yuk but it was a novelty.

So over their lives my parents went through many phases of eating and when they retired their biggest treat was going out for a drive with their trays and cutlery, buying fish and chips and eating it on the seafront.

My Dad never saw a doctor until he was 80 and like I said in my other post they both had a very sweet tooth!

I think this UPF business is just the current thing to get worked up about but it isn’t going to get me worked up! 🤣🤣

I can’t help thinking you’ve missed the point Primrose53, our parents generation were little affected, ours more so, and our children and grandchildren, on average exponentially more so.
The Institute of Economic Affairs have a huge vested interest in us eating the cheapest food available, so they are bound to be concerned about any programme that tells us not to eat highly processed food because it’s bad for us. I don’t see how anybody could think it does no harm.

Looks fantastic. What a great community enterprise. Well done
Penicuik

Grammaretto

I buy most of my food from our wonderful community store. I let their buyer do the research for me.
This way I can be sure that I consume no UPF.
I have now watched Panorama. I don't think any of it was news to me.
www.penicuikstorehouse.org

I was in there today. I can highly recommend it!

It is the ultra aspect that is the villain of the peace

tickingbird

Primrose Yes but your parents were cooking from scratch and wouldn’t have been eating very much Ultra processed food. That’s the difference.

I said they were “brought up on” foods like suet, yorkshires etc so in my parents case by the time they were starting a family in their mid twenties, there was more money around after the war years and rationing.

Very slowly, there was more choice too! They were eating stuff like sausages, ham, cakes, trifles, crisps etc. all of which would now be called UPF.

Fast forward a decade or so and sugary breakfast cereals were available, salad creams, sauces, Angel Delight, fruity yoghourts and ice cream were all the rage which us kids loved. In my teenage years we pestered Mum to get us Boil in the Bag delights like Vesta Curry and Paella. Yuk, yuk, yuk but it was a novelty.

So over their lives my parents went through many phases of eating and when they retired their biggest treat was going out for a drive with their trays and cutlery, buying fish and chips and eating it on the seafront.

My Dad never saw a doctor until he was 80 and like I said in my other post they both had a very sweet tooth!

I think this UPF business is just the current thing to get worked up about but it isn’t going to get me worked up! 🤣🤣

For example, Tesco full fat Greek style yoghurt has 4.2g of carbs per 100g, while low fat full fat Greek yoghurt has 5.2g of carbs. That's because some form of emulsifier has been added.

Incidentally, most oat milks and many vegetarian ready meals are considered ultra-processed.

Chris Snowdon, Head of Lifestyle Economics at The Institute of Economic Affairs describes the Panorama programme as “the most irresponsible piece of television I have seen in years.” I think I agree with him. Those Dr brothers are always on TV and one has just written a book about UPF so they stand to gain from this scaremongering.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/06/06/there-is-nothing-healthy-about-bbc-paranoia-over-upf/

AGAA4

It's the emulsifiers that are put into food that can be very bad for health. They have been passed as safe by people who have an 'interest' in the companies that make them.
It is surprising how many foods have emulsifier added.

Ironically, foods often sold as the "healthy" option because they're low fat have more emulsifiers, which they need as thickening agents.