Statins please share your experience/knowledge

My GP insisted I required statins for high cholesterol. I was dubious not wishing to take medication when my diet was good an no real explanation given for my high cholesterol. I took them for a month. My skin erupted in huge red pus filled lumps. A year later it is still healing. It is a recorded side effect. I refuse to take them

My family has a history of heart attacks. I have been taking statins 20mg for about 30 years. My cholesterol reading was 9.5 my sister 8.9, so clearly genetic. Up to the time of writing I haven't had any side effects, I am 83 years of age. My Pa, cousin and uncle dropped dead very young, i.e.60, 57, 52.

Statins seem to be the ‘go-to’ drug that many GP’s seem quite keen to prescribe and they say, once on them, you’re on them indefinitely - an easy cash cow. Often prescribed for high cholesterol and linked to BP - this was suggested to me but I refused them and decided to lower my cholesterol myself through adjusting my diet and hence lowering my BP. Same with my husband. All too often doctors prescribe without looking at the root cause and often if we take control of our diet/exercise routine, we can make changes without the reliance on drugs.

Urmstongran

Well this thread is prescient! My lovely female GP rang me today. To chat about my recent bloods and to discuss how I am doing. “I know there’s a lot of stress at home”. My cholesterol has jumped from 5.5 to 7.8. But then she said “look I could throw pills at you but how about you try addressing diet/exercise first and we will retest you in 6 months?” Sounds sensible to me, I didn’t feel panicked as it wasn’t 2 months and just hope tweaking my choices shows an improvement. I’m 70 btw.

Sounds sensible to me too. I do hope your cholesterol will come down (and the stress eventually).

winterwhite

Sorry to ask for a recap, Nanna and Skye, but I don’t understand the connection between statins and Co Q 10. Are you saying that if we’re on statins we shouldn’t take a C Q 10
supplement?

Hi winterwhite. No, I didn’t mean that - I don’t know if that’s OK or not. I was quoting Dr Myhill, who says that statins stop an important process in the body, which involves coenzyme Q10, from working properly. This means that mitochondria (energy-producing structures in cells) don’t work at normal speed, but slowly. This affects many body systems.

Dr Myhill quotes this paper, which states that:

//The statin medications routinely result in lower coenzyme Q10 levels in the serum. Some studies have also shown reduction of coenzyme Q10 in muscle tissue. Such enzyme Q10 deficiency maybe one mechanism for statin induced myopathies [muscle diseases].//
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3096178/

In other words, statins cause low levels of coenzyme Q10 in the blood and in muscles, and this may cause muscle disorders.

I’d ask your GP about whether you can take coenzyme Q10 with statins.

She has coauthored three papers in peer-reviewed medical journals, so I don’t think her understanding of research is too hazy. She has also written seven books, one of which won an award from the British Medical Association.

growstuff

I actually agree with her about this:

"There is a general belief that a high fat diet results in high cholesterol, which results in arterial and heart disease. The evidence to support this theory is poor - the two largest culprits in arterial disease are refined carbohydrates (including sugars and fruit sugars) and high blood pressure from adrenalin - the stress hormone. The commonest cause of stress is rapidly falling levels of blood sugar, but any stress - lack of sleep, financial, emotional stress will also result in adrenalin."

Unfortunately, she then started mentioning antioxidants and pushing her agenda. She's a naturopath, so I'm afraid i Don't trust her objectivity. Not only that, but she's not a scientist and seems to have a hazy understanding of research and what actually happens in the body.

Dr Myhill has a first class honours degree in medicine and has worked as a GP. Her website is there to provide free information to the public and is not pushing an agenda.

Sorry to ask for a recap, Nanna and Skye, but I don’t understand the connection between statins and Co Q 10. Are you saying that if we’re on statins we shouldn’t take a C Q 10
supplement?

I've been taking Atorvastatin 40mg for at least 15 years and can honestly say that I haven't noticed any side-effects. I have Hashimoto's disease (causing an underactive thyroid) and high cholestorol is one of the resulting complications. It also can exacerbate depression, which I have suffered from in the past and have taken medication for, but luckily I am not having to take anti-depressants at the moment.

I am happy to take the advice of my GP, whom I trust, and reduce the risks of stroke/heart problems, but if I had noticed any side-effects from taking my current statin then I would ask if there were alternatives I could try.

This is the British Heart Foundation's opinion of the study behind the Telegraph article:

www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/heart-matters-magazine/news/behind-the-headlines/cholesterol-and-statins

It points out that two of the writers are not impartial, including Aseem Malhotra.

Mind you ‘reducing stress’ isn’t really an option, sadly. That’s a concern of and in itself - healthwise for my heart - in more ways than one.
😢

Well this thread is prescient! My lovely female GP rang me today. To chat about my recent bloods and to discuss how I am doing. “I know there’s a lot of stress at home”. My cholesterol has jumped from 5.5 to 7.8. But then she said “look I could throw pills at you but how about you try addressing diet/exercise first and we will retest you in 6 months?” Sounds sensible to me, I didn’t feel panicked as it wasn’t 2 months and just hope tweaking my choices shows an improvement. I’m 70 btw.

I actually agree with her about this:

"There is a general belief that a high fat diet results in high cholesterol, which results in arterial and heart disease. The evidence to support this theory is poor - the two largest culprits in arterial disease are refined carbohydrates (including sugars and fruit sugars) and high blood pressure from adrenalin - the stress hormone. The commonest cause of stress is rapidly falling levels of blood sugar, but any stress - lack of sleep, financial, emotional stress will also result in adrenalin."

Unfortunately, she then started mentioning antioxidants and pushing her agenda. She's a naturopath, so I'm afraid i Don't trust her objectivity. Not only that, but she's not a scientist and seems to have a hazy understanding of research and what actually happens in the body.

growstuff

Skye17

fancyflowers

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

No, I wouldn’t either. Evidently there are different opinions among researchers.

//The role of blood cholesterol levels in coronary heart disease (CHD) and the true effect of cholesterol-lowering statin drugs are debatable. In particular, whether statins actually decrease cardiac mortality and increase life expectancy is controversial… We conclude that the expectation that CHD could be prevented or eliminated by simply reducing cholesterol appears unfounded.//

I resisted taking statins for years because I don't like putting drugs inside my body. I have never been overweight and had a reasonably healthy lifestyle. Like so many, I thought I was invincible. I was told my risk of having a cardiac event, but my risk of not having one was higher, so I refused statins.

That all changed in October 2017, when I had a heart attack. I was lucky because an ambulance got me to Papworth within a few minutes and I had a stent fitted, but I am under no illusions that if the heart attack had happened elsewhere, I could be dead.

I have taken statins (and a whole load of other drugs) since then. I've actually felt fitter than I have for years. I'm T2 diabetic and my Hba1c levels are monitored. There has been no increase since 2017, so I'll carry on taking the pills!

I'm not telling anyone not to take statins, growstuff. Obviously that is up to the individual, and I hope you will stay fit.

I'm just saying that medical opinions do differ on the risks and benefits of statins. They also differ on the relationship between cholesterol and arterial disease.

E g, Dr Sarah Myhill writes, 'a high cholesterol may be a symptom of arterial disease rather than the cause. It is only when LDL becomes oxidised into lipid peroxides as a result of poor antioxidant status that it may be directly damaging to arteries... There is no doubt some people do have genetically high levels of LDL cholesterol (the "bad" one) and do suffer excessively from arterial disease, but this should only occur where there is poor antioxidant status.'
drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Cholesterol_-_the_whys_and_wherefores

I've actually read the Aseem Malhotra's (the cardiologist) book. He actually has very little experience, but know how to make money. Very few other cardiologists have much respect for him. I read the book and it went straight in the bin when I'd finished. His stats (where they existed) were extremely suspect and it was obvious that he was cherry picking. His aim was (is) to promote his diet, which differs very little from a standard "healthy diet".

I wouldn't dispute that a healthier lifestyle at population level would result in fewer cardiac events. However, about 75% of over 60 year olds are overweight are obese; we don't eat enough fibre, but too eat too much processed food; we don't move around enough. If somebody were to wave a magic wand and get everybody moving and eating healthily and reducing stress, the need for medical intervention would be reduced, but that's not realistic. Even then, some people would die earlier than others for unknown reasons. It's all about risk and if people want to take that risk and follow dodgy writers, that's up to them.

Jaxjacky

Justin Smith is not a doctor for a start fancyflowers he’s an ex engineer and now a personal trainer and nutrition coach who’s probably made a few quid from the book. I can’t be bothered to research the rest of them.

I had a look on Amazon. The Dark Side of Statins is by someone with an American medical degree (MD). He also wrote Statin Drugs.

The Great Cholesterol Myth is by a nutritionist with a PhD.

A Statin Nation is by a practising GP.

A Statin Free Life is by a cardiologist.

The Truth About Statins is by another MD, director of the Women's Cardiac Center at the Miriam Hospital in Rhode Island.

All but two of these books are by professional doctors.

As I said in a previous post, medical opinion on statins varies. There is more than one side to the picture.

Skye17

fancyflowers

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

No, I wouldn’t either. Evidently there are different opinions among researchers.

//The role of blood cholesterol levels in coronary heart disease (CHD) and the true effect of cholesterol-lowering statin drugs are debatable. In particular, whether statins actually decrease cardiac mortality and increase life expectancy is controversial… We conclude that the expectation that CHD could be prevented or eliminated by simply reducing cholesterol appears unfounded.//

I resisted taking statins for years because I don't like putting drugs inside my body. I have never been overweight and had a reasonably healthy lifestyle. Like so many, I thought I was invincible. I was told my risk of having a cardiac event, but my risk of not having one was higher, so I refused statins.

That all changed in October 2017, when I had a heart attack. I was lucky because an ambulance got me to Papworth within a few minutes and I had a stent fitted, but I am under no illusions that if the heart attack had happened elsewhere, I could be dead.

I have taken statins (and a whole load of other drugs) since then. I've actually felt fitter than I have for years. I'm T2 diabetic and my Hba1c levels are monitored. There has been no increase since 2017, so I'll carry on taking the pills!

fancyflowers

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

Quite honestly, that article reads more like an advertising campaign for the so-called Mediterranean diet.

It is one article amongst the many thousands which have been written about statins; it's also nine years old. Incidentally, there's at least one factual error. Diabetics don't have "average" cholesterol levels. They very often have high triglyceride levels, which are part of a standard liver profile test. T2 diabetics also often have metabolic syndrome, which includes high blood pressure and high cholesterol.

I don't think anybody would claim that statins will prevent heart attacks or strokes completely, if people have other unhealthy lifestyle factors, such as being overweight, smoking, drinking too much alcohol and not exercising ... or having bad genes. I expect we all know somebody who lived to 100 while smoking like a chimney and being grossly overweight. There is no magic formula to predict when somebody will die or have a heart attack. It's about risk and meta-analyses of many studies have shown that high total cholesterol with low HDL and a high ratio is a risk factor.

If a relatively cheap drug can reduce that risk (along with healthy lifestyles) why not use it? Yes, there are people who genuinely can't tolerate statins, so they will just have to accept an increased risk.

fancyflowers

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

No, I wouldn’t either. Evidently there are different opinions among researchers.

//The role of blood cholesterol levels in coronary heart disease (CHD) and the true effect of cholesterol-lowering statin drugs are debatable. In particular, whether statins actually decrease cardiac mortality and increase life expectancy is controversial… We conclude that the expectation that CHD could be prevented or eliminated by simply reducing cholesterol appears unfounded.//

I’ve been on statins for over 30 years. I’m still here. The only side effects I have had is dry skin on my legs ( my skin specialist told me this was a cause ) and slight muscular pains if I take a higher dose ( recommended but I stick to the lower dose because of it ). My cholesterol went from 8 down to 4 and hovers between 4 and 5 now. Our family has a history of very high cholesterol and everyone dies of heart attacks sooner or later. My husband got very sick on one brand so switched to another which works for him. For me, I think it has been worth it.

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

I took all types and they all made me feel dreadful, would rather live another 10 years feeling well, than 20 years feeling like that .
They now have me trying Supralip with is fenofibrate.
Its not a station but cholesterol lowering apparently, but I am not sure about this now, I am feeling a bit lethargic, going to try a few weeks anyway and make a decision about these

On Simvastatin for at least twenty years, with no side-effects. I, too, miss the grapefruit

My cholesterol continued to rise steadily despite my best efforts with my diet and the use of plant stanol products. 2 years ago I started taking a statin at the lowest dose. My cholesterol has now gone down to an acceptable level. I still take care with my diet but sometimes it’s nice not to have to worry, for example when travelling or visiting friends. I’ve had no side effects but if I had I would have asked the GP to change to another drug.

fancyflowers Statins have been prescribed for years to many millions of people. There are enough statistics to know that if, for example, a million people were to take statins, fewer of them would have heart problems over (say) ten years than if they didn't.

It's also true that some people have side effects they can't tolerate, but on balance the benefits outweigh the negative side effects for the majority of people. Unfortunately, doctors don't always know how medications will affect individuals.

It is also true that statins have suffered from an extraordinary amount of negative publicity and some so-called doctors have jumped on the band wagon. Research has shown that people taking placebos are just as likely to suffer negative side effects from statins as those taking the real thing. One study even showed that more people claimed they have side effects taking a placebo!

In the end, it's your body and it's up to you what you put in it. If you have good genes and a healthy lifestyle, luck is probably on your side, but none of us has a crystal ball. Statins will lower risk of heart problems, but they won't eliminate all risk.