Should Joan Rivers be able to tell tasteless holocaust joke just because she is Jewish?

I don't understand the question. "Should JR be able to tell…? Who should censor her or any other person from telling a joke and on what grounds? You certainly couldn't do it on the grounds of either tastelesness or not being funny or more than half the stand-ups in the country would have to go on job seeker's allowance. Can you make a tasteful joke about the Holocaust? I would guess that is highly debatable and equally highly subjective. Can you only make jokes about the Holocaust if you're Jewish? Surely that would be racial discrimination.

That some comedian has made a singularly unfunny throwaway remark about the Holocaust is a very trivial concern in the great scheme of things. It's just a load of old nonsense and a storm in a teacup for those with nothing better to think about.

Do you know, I think she may have thought about it a fair bit, since most of her husband's family died under the Nazis. And making cutting quips about it is her way of coping. She didn't make the comment public; the Outrage Brigade did that for her.

Whereas, as ej says, stuff they really ought to get outraged about goes unnoticed.

It's just celebrity garbarge all this hue and cry about one off the cuff remark. It happens because people seem to thrive on the sensation of "being shocked by someone else."

I doubt if she thought about it that deeply. Just so long as she keeps adding to her pile of dollars......

I think you have hit the nail on the head FlicketyB

Adam Hills has just been very funny, joking about Joan Rivers on The Last Leg, channel 4. Worth watching!

Sometimes society is over sensitive, particularly about references to Nazi/Jew/Holocaust. An appalling situation that the world should always be mindful of.

A one line 'joke' is not really worth making a fuss about...more people will hear it now there has been a fuss made.

More shocking was the article I read today of the enforced contraceptive injections given to the Ethiopian Jews who have gone to live in Israel.. now that seems to be worth the Jerusalen Herald reporting..though do not know that it did!

It is the difference between the jokes you make within a group and those that go out to a wider community. As a child in a catholic home I can rememberthat the best anti-catholic jokes were told by priests, but only when within a small group of friends, all catholic. I think the same about Joan Rivers, as a jew, of course she can make jokes like this, but only within her close Jewish community.

Most communities, police, army, teachers, will have a form of black humour shared between the group that helps to deal with the stresses and problems they face professionally, but this humour can and will be misinterpreted if repeated outside that group

That's alright then dorsetpent. #nosillyrowsonthisthread

JO8how is Bags back tracking I think she was just explaining the points she made to me.

Barrow Joan Rivers is a comedianne - though I don't think her style appeals to the English audience - when I lived in the US in the 70's and 80's she was hugely popular. Heidi Klum is a model who married Seal, had 4 kids and is now divorcing him. Does it seem sad that I know all this?

Please explain where the backtracking is. I can't find any.

I don't think anyone is, jings. Really just acknowledging what happens when certain factions of humanity get too much power.

Backtracking or what?

And I am not entering into any "worst genocides" competitions.

I think that is what I was saying, dorset (or trying to), that the Germans do need to be reminded about the holocaust, as do we all. And the younger generations who know nothing of it yet need to be told of it too.

My best friend is German and it gets on her wick a bit because she wasn't even born when it happened, but I try to explain that we all have to take responsibility for what human beings are capable of in order to prevent such a thing happening again.

Though, as dorset says, we haven't prevented similar genocides happening elsewhere.

absent, I had heard of Heidi Klum (though forgotten her as well) but I hadn't heard of Joan Rivers. Can't say I mind. I'll now forget about her too.

Heidi Klum is a model and Joan Rivers is the one who has had all the cosmetic surgery.

Who the hell is Heidi Klum? Is Joan Rivers the woman with the funny pointy face?

I think it's a bit like whistling in the dark - a joke made about the holocaust could be a way of managing the guilt so many Jews feel about it.I'm sorry Bags but the Germans need to be reminded, as do we all, as it happened again. The Kurds and the Muslim men and boys in Serbia as just one example.
At least the Germans acknowlege the holocaust unlike the Japanese who have totally wiped out any memories of their treatment of the Chinese in Nanking and the POW camps in WW2.

It's not a question of comparing the telling of the joke with the actual event! Why would it be?!

I have always felt that the holocaust is the one event that has most blighted the time I have been on this earth. Perhaps that is because it involved children and their families and I learnt about it when I was a child.

Whatever, the holocaust should never be joked about. Never.

And quite honestly, if there is anyone anywhere who can't see that, then I don't want to communicate with them.

jings, supposing I agree with you that what JR said is offensive. Then what? This is what: SO WHAT compared to the Holocaust?

Who has been starved, used as slave labour, wrenched from their home, separated from their family, subjected to many other unspeakable horrors, and then gassed as a result of what JR said? Who will have all those things done to them as a result of what she said?

No-one. Not a single person. That's who.

Now, remind me how many died and suffered as a direct result of what the Nazis did? And how many died and suffered as an indirect result of what the Nazis did? Wasn't it a millions of individuals?

And isn't the holocaust not just a stain on Germany, but on Europe, and indeed on the whole human race?

The holocaust couldn't and can't be ignored. What some silly bitch of a humourist says can be ignored. We wouldn't even know about it (and neither would Heidi Klum because it wasn't said to her) but for the Outrage Brigade making such a fuss.

No comparison.

Yes, it is totally tasteless, but that does not mean that J.R. should not say it. I don't like her humour in this instance, yet it has made an impact. It's that impact that reminds us of the horrors that occurred. Never should this be forgotten.

"I don't interpret what Rivers said as in any way offensive to Jews" (quoting Bags)

IT'S OFFENSIVE TO THE WHOLE OF THE HUMAN RACE!!!!!!!

Or it bloody well should be!

I think you're right. I was misled a little by the title of the thread. My answer to the title question is Yes, she should 'be able' to make tastelss holocaust 'jokes' (quips might be a npbetter description) regardless of whether she is Jewish herself. Nothing anyone could say could ever be as bad by several orders of magnitude as what the Nazis DID to other human beings.

No idea why the Jerusalem Herald is making a fuss. That was just my take on it.

And it's a reminder to the rest of us, including Germans, who weren't even born then, of the damage that "groupthink" can do.

Why is the Jerusalem Herald making a fuss and demanding an apology then?

And anyway, if it is offensive to Germans (of the non-Jewish variety; the murdered victims were often German too!), that's just tough. Yes, it must be a bit tiresome to be reminded all the time. Again, that's tough. T's unfortunate to have a history that keeps coming back to bite you in the bum, but better that than to forget.