Nurse training - make them work as health care assistants? Will this help?

I think it is an excellent idea. It is patently obvious what benefits it 'could' have. If you get the feel of a job from the start you will know pretty damned quick if bum wiping and holding a sick bowl is the vocatiion for you.

I can see that going into university, doing your course work, taking your exams and getting your pass takes so much of your time, when you start your job and find you hate it, you would think to yourself I have to stick with this and I hate every minute. It goes belly up from there on.

Empathy is not a natural human function to everybody. There will always be good and bad medical staff! The facts have spoken for themself. If you seriously want to see how the nursing profession has lost it's way then just look up the replies given to the Select Committees from the heads of Nursing and the North Staffs Report. That is the truth of it.

I think there will be a lot of good nurses who will say 'about time'. I hope with all my heart the nursing profession regains it's rightful public appreciation for the work they do. Give this a chance, it is greatly needed both by us, the patient, and the good nurse who wants to see we admire the work they are dedicated to giving us.

You can still do pre-nursing courses at 6th form. They just call them something else.

Back in the sixties there was a pre-nursing course available in most technical/further education colleges. I knew two girls who did this. One went on to be an excellent nurse and the other realised she was not suited to nursing and switched to a secretarial course. Agricultural colleges used to insist on a year's practical experience before they would offer a place (I don't know if they still do this).

The best seniors in any job are the ones who understand the basics and the importance of good supervision in all areas.

I was thinking that, Tanith, but then the NHS wouldn't want a high drop-out rate every year as they'd have to keep spending money training another lot.

I think it might actually make people realise what a difficult job nursing is, and those that doen't have it in them won't carry on to do the nursing course. Hopefully resulting in more nurses who have the 'right attitude' to the job. In the ambulance service it always used to be that recruits had to join the patient transport service before becoming an 'ambulance tech', it was very successful in weeding out those who thought the job was all bells and whistles as you were dealing with the sick, elderly and mentally ill on a daily basis , in and out with out-patients and delivering Alzheimer patients to their day centres. It certainly made the younger recruits better equipped to deal with patients .

I heard on the radio this morning that nurses were going to have to do a stint of Nursing Auxilliary work. If that is the case they will think that this is beneath them when they become qualified. Surely they should be taught that this, as well as other forms of caring are their job?

If they employed more nurses instead of management, the NHS wouldn't be in this mess.
There will always be some bad nurses, but most nurses care very much.

Sounds like they are talking about a whole year.
I wonder what affect this will have on nurse recruitment?
The woman on the radio from the Staffs pressure group was not impressed "its the culture" she said repeatedly.

My first term on the wards at the QE Birmingham all of ups medical students had to do two weeks nursing. Not much I know. But it gave us an idea of what it was like.
Being ex boarding school, I was the only one who knew what hospital corners were. I still use them.

Attitude of mind is what matters. They need to be caring and to regard every aspect of patient care from the most menial to the most technically sophisticated as important. A sense of vocation might help too - but maybe you can't train that in.

I have worked with and been cared for by some wonderful nurses and some seriously bad ones. One important factor was the ward sister (or whatever he/she might be called now) - if he/she was good then it filtered down to everyone and the ward was a different place.

No amount of bum-wiping for a year will change things if the student nurses do not imbibe the right attitudes from their tutors and the other nurses around them.

We live in a society that devalues manual/craft labour and every school-leaver is led to feel that they need an academic degree - the problems in nursing are just part of a bigger picture and a wider problem.

It's how nurses used to be trained, isn't it? The first year did all the heaviest work and some of the personal care and if they didn't do it well, they were advised not to carry on. And the people who ran the hospital (not called managers then) had gone through the same training so had a good idea of what made a good nurse.

I trained as a SRN in the seventies. Before each intake, we were encouraged work as auxiliary nurses which I did for six months. It was a great introduction to the profession and we learned such a lot. Primary care should be the cornerstone of nursing!

I can't see that this will make nurses any more "caring". There will be those who are naturally caring and don't need this kind of experience, others would do the year and then once qualified would leave the basic care to the newbies.

When my late DH was in hospital there were nurses who were fantastic, caring for him and me but others who did the very least they could get away with and treating me as a nuisance (in fact I stayed with him for the whole of his hospital stay and fed him, changed his sheets, washed him and helped him to the bathroom).