Bedroom tax breaches human rights.

Within half a mile of me in opposite directions there are two highly rated state primary schools and also an excellent prep school. The road past them all is littered by upmarket 4x4s, a scene that's probably repeated in many affluent areas.

I am in favour of breakfast club, and a nutritious midday meal, free for those on lower incomes or benefits. BUT I just don't see how this coalition makes decisions on how best to support children. They removed child benefit from 'wealthy' parents where one earns just over the £40,000 mark, continue giving it to families where both parents earn just under that line. The bedroom tax, the closure of so many family centres, sure start etc, decimating front line social work teams and leaving children and families without the support many of them need. Is it me?!

They're making such a big thing about free school meals for the under 7s. Hull Labour Council was the first council to introduce free school meals for all primary children. Hull University did independent research into the effects it had on the children. The next election the Lib Dems took control of the council and as Hull University was publishing it's findings saying that the policy was virtually the greatest thing since sliced bread, the Lib Dem council decided to cancel it and make meals payable again as part of it's massive cost cutting exercise.

When meals were free we had an average of 95% uptake. The children got a healthy midday meal and, as teachers, we noticed the difference in behaviour and concentration in the afternoons. The school was in a very deprived area and so when charges were reintroduced uptake of meals plummeted.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2013/09/17/venn-diagrams-for-our-times-the-housing-budget/

Nothing the Lib Dems say makes sense to me.

So according to the Libdem Conference, if you have two children aged 5 and 7 next September, they can have free school meals, but they cannot have a bedroom each.
Does that make sense to you?

The best laugh was when the deputy of Sunderland Tory Party blamed the last Labour government for not building enough single bedroomed units.

Anyone in the North East, there is a discussion on this topic on the radio, radionewcastle.

Commiserations, Jendurham - I have also had problems with HMRC because the departments dealing with PAYE and SA do not communicate with each other, so I had money sitting in one account whilst receiving repeated demands for the same amount from the other account. I made numerous phone calls, wrote to them and was told several times that it would be put right. Things have gone downhill fast since I retired, along with many other experienced inspectors.
It used to be the case that penalties could not be applied if no tax was due, so you should have had a good case before the Commissioners. I would like to know how you get on - a pm, perhaps?

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/203097/nsfr-final-090513.pdf

I was just going to write that, Greatnan, but you beat me to it.
The above link is to the government website.
If you can't be bothered to read the figires, the latest figures are
£1.9 billion lost through benefit fraud which is 0.7% of the welfare budget
£10.2 billion lost through tax avoidance schemes
£5.5 billion goes unclaimed, but they are happy to hang on to that.

I may be included in the tax fraud figures.
Until last week I was being pursued by HMRC for not filling in a tax return which last year I was told I need not fill in. The penalties had gone up to £1300, which I appealed against. They would not look into my appeal until I had sent them a tax return that I had been told I need not fill in.
This was not my personal tax return, it was from a trust set up when Ken died. There was no money involved, so no tax to pay.
I got to the stage where I was saying that they could take me to court, I wasn't bothered. There must have been two people sitting in the same office, one writing that I need not send in the tax return, and the other sending a letter off at the same time fining me more money.
It would probably make a good sitcom.

I enjoyed the chat about memories of East Hull!
Latest news - anybody found guilty of benefit fraud can be sentenced to up to ten years in prison. I wonder how long the bankers who fixed the Libor rate will get? Or the corporate tax evaders?
And before anybody jumps in - no, I am not defending benefit fraud.

Jendurham and Vampire - serendipity, great thread and I don't feel you hijacked it with your comments.
Glamma - same here for my grandchildren and their separated parents. Both on benefits, the children spend half the week with each parents, the older boy is 19 but has special needs - it's a nightmare for all of them. So many of us with close family members, or friends, who are 'vulnerable' in various ways and suffering the dreadful stress of trying to make money spread to places it just can't go.
The piece from the MP (jendurham 15.09.13 18.12) is so relevant to what's happening with attacks on the unemployed and sick right now

In March the Huffington Post reported that a UN rapporteur - a different one- found the UKs stance on foodbanks, poverty and austerity extremely worrying. I cannot remember the government being rude about the UN rapporteur then. Could it be because it was a man?
just-fair.co.uk/

Is there anyone on here who still believes that the bedroom tax - sorry, spare room subsidy, is okay?

If anybody is being hassled to pay more than they can afford on debts, they can get help from the government-funded CCCS - Consumer Credit Counselling Service. They will supply drafts of letters to the creditors and arrange for one payment to be made to them each month which they will distribute to the various creditors. Many creditors will accept a reduced amount in full and final settlement, but this will show on credit rating reports, such as Experian, for six years.

The rule in the Inland Revenue used to be that if you were undercharged, or given too much rebate, you did not have to repay it if you could not 'reasonably' be expected to realise it was a mistake.

I didn't know about The False Economy site thanks for that will look to-morrow.

Yes, but it is wrong that you should have to, Glamma.
If it's a labour council, they should be willing to take only a pound extra each week, particularly as they will hopefully be in power well before the money needs to be paid off.
This sort of thing just makes me feel sick. Of course the councils get it in the neck when the government comes up with any new scheme and the councils have to enforce it.
Please go on the False Economy website and report this if you have not already done so.
It's the same with Hunt and the NHS. He thinks of a scheme to claw money back from hospitals, then says, oh, I'll give you a little bit of it back if you behave yourselves.
I bet this lot always won at Monopoly.

Vampirequeen we are fortunate to be in the position to pay this shortfall for her and get her back up to date with her rent,but I dread to think what others are going through,she just couldn't cut her budget any further as she also has an older boy at Uni and we make sure he is fed and watered as well,I feel so sorry for her as she has worked hard to get the boys the Education they have she can't find a job anywhere for more than 16hrs a week and is stuck in a trap,she is a foster mum to a little man whose nursery fee's have to be paid from her allowance so she is no better off with her job,but she has always worked and wants the job as she enjoys it so much.I can see things going from bad to worse with this scheme and there is going to be many people revolting in some way or another.

They'll see it's wrong but they'll also see that it's the rules and the rules must be obeyed. There used to be some leeway in their application and common sense often prevailed in favour of the claimant with the 'debt' being written off. Now, however, this is rarely done. The argument being 'you've had money you weren't entitled to and we want it back regardless of the facts that a) it wasn't your fault and b) you can't afford to pay it back'

However she should be able to pay it back at a very small amount each week. If she makes out a budget and shows she has no money spare they can't demand a lump sum or quick repayment.

I have debts with several companies, albeit not with the council, and they accept £1 a month as they can see I have no money and they're not allowed to demand more than you can afford. One company did take me to court to demand more but the court told them that my offer of £1 a month was reasonable and that's all I have to pay. It's set in stone by the judgement so even if I won the lottery I could continue to pay £1 a month and you can bet I would because they tried to bully me.

I cannot believe that, Glamma.
Who is your daughter's MP? She really needs to write to her MP. Even a Tory should be able to see that it's completely wrong.

This is the ridiculous situation that we find ourselves in.

Just going back to when jendurhams post re ages of children affecting the housing benefit allowed, DD has just found out that she has a shortfall of rent due £360.00 because eldest DGS was 18 last November and whilst he is still in full time education by law he was old enough to leave school at the end of the Easter term even though he has just gone back to school for his final year,he has two younger brothers and a sister living at home,at Easter the youngest brother was just 9yrs old so the powers that be have reduced her HB from the Easter until youngest brother was 10 in August she was not informed this was happening so just carried on paying the usual amount of rent she has always paid,we have now had to find the shortfall for her for those 5mths or she would be worrying her self senceless as to how she was going to pay it.The system is so complicated the HB team could not tell her how they had ommitted to inform her and they where not bothered in the least.

Maybe he thinks he's doing his bit by wearing his polo shirt more than once.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2397931/David-Samantha-Cameron-Cornwall-Prime-Minister-enjoys-FOURTH-holiday-year.html

I love the way he used Easyjet then stayed in an £11K a week villa. That's really tightening his belt

Well he's a hip guy who's well up with popular culture

No, I've googled it and there is a poster in 1999 in a window.
So he borrowed it. Actually it's also in a song by Carole King and in High School Musical.
I bet he got it from High School Musical!