Lord Rennard

I think there are a small proportion of men that are confident to approach lots of women - they don't worry about knock-backs, they just keep steaming ahead.

I do not think the majority of men or women expect every member of the opposite sex to think they are gods gift to them.

It is just that women are expected to be grateful if a man, any man, fancies them and the men that do go around thinking they are gods gift are so objectionable.

Yes, I agree. I think they do exist, though probably they would never admit it.

Yes, plenty.

I think there are a few absent - they are not all arrogant and some of them have low self esteem.

anno Is there any man in the world who really believes that he is unattractive to women?

The subject of women dealing with men making passes at work came up on Matthew Wright's show this morning. Lowry Turner mentioned a case where a woman she knew made a formal complaint about unwanted touching at work. The man in question was duly reprimanded and the upshot of it was that when ever she had future contact with this particular man he made a point of exclaiming "frigid" to her in a loud voice. It put me in mind of having similar experiences when I was working in various offices in my late teens and twenties, and the response to a rebuff would be "are you a lesbian?" sorry no disrespect to lesbians. The arrogance of some men, usually unattractive I might add, is often to make some slur about their victim because they know that they are reviled as a lecherous slimeball.

I have a feeling that he know he isn't very attractive to women.

He is just a man who reached the 'dirty old' stage prematurely.

Exactly, Jess.

Do you not think that the term "old goat" somehow denies that fact that he was for many years the most powerful man in the party - makes him seem like a silly eccentric?

Not even a very 'old' goat. Born in 1960, he's younger than a lot of us, though his corpulent appearance makes him look much older.

There's a world of difference between wanting to, or imagining, you could give someone a hefty slap, and carrying it out. It's one of many ways to cope with unbearable, unwanted behaviour and has helped many women on the receiving end of such abuse to think about their oppressor being powerless to cope with the aggressive acts they are inflicting on others. Calling him an 'old goat' doesn't diminish what he has been doing. I wonder how many more women gave been on the receiving end? It's unlikely he only started doing this in the last few years.

It's so wrong, to minimise sexual harassment by referring to the perpetrator as 'an old goat'. It suggests a strong, healthy young woman could simply 'slap' the man, and that would be the end of it. No wonder people who have been sexually assaulted, or harassed, find it so difficult to complain with this type of response.

Yes margaretm74 - not hard to work that one out SV. People might "slap" someone of equal status but how many people at the bottom of the pecking order go round "slapping" alpha males? Would she have "slapped" a managing editor of a newspaper when she was a junior reporter? Is it a wise idea "slapping" men anyway - can they be relied upon to hit back?

Yes, that smug awful Sarah Vine. I also saw the headline, but confess to having skimmed through her piece. Loathsome, heartless and simply dim was my conclusion. (Sitting on the fence as you can see)

Not that smug awful Sarah Vine again! Probably they didn't because he was the all-powerful one who made the decisions about who landed which job or became a prospective candidate?

I like Quentin Letts, he can come across as a bit of a PSB but he's very sharp and funny.

If that apostrophe is wrong, I'm sorry

I saw that too Jess but didn't bother reading it. I thought Quentin Letts' piece was a good one though.

Musing on the role of "kingmaker" which Rennard filled for years - top dog in the party but not going for election himself. Started as a political agent, fresh out of student politics and worked his way up from there.
There is a headline in the Mail today that made me sigh:

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2543549/SARAH-VINE-Why-didnt-Lib-Dem-ladies-just-old-goat-slap.html

I'm sure they have taken constitutional, and probably legal advice. What is the matter with this chap, and his supporters. If I hear another senior lib dem apologist say people are comparing him to JS, I may just, well shout probably. I haven't heard anyone comparing Lord R's behaviour to that of a serial, predatory and dangerous sex offender. That isn't the point, but they just don' seem to get that. So sad for Lib Dem supporters, and for the rest of us, as we definitely need a 3rd party we can trust

You would think so wouldn't you! Specially after the mess.

Speaking from experience (and you'll have to take my word for that), I know that no Lib Dem Party disciplinary committee would go ahead with suspending so prominent a member without having the best possible constitutional advice from another senior officer of the party.

And now he is taking court action to overturn his suspension, on procedural grounds (i.e. they did not follow party rules in suspending me).
Seems that he is fighting his corner, no matter what the cost to the LibDem party that he has worked so hard for. Getting egged on, obviously.

Will Clegg to survive this brutal rebellion by some of the senior member of his party?

Stupid man! He should apologise! Didn't I see somewhere that the accusations couldn't be proved, but there was strong evidence to support it.