Or rather "not in the news"

www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jun/24/living-wage-commission-report-minimum-pay

The picture is from the anti-austerity march, but the Guardian says it was a march about the living wage.

www.theguardian.com/books/2014/jun/18/harrys-last-stand-harry-leslie-smith-austerity-bites-mary-ohara-review

Excellent review by Melissa Benn on two books about austerity.

The problem is that it does not seem possible. IDS is getting into all sorts of problems sorting it out, and he keeps telling everyone he's on time. The only reason he thinks he is doing it on time is because he keeps changing the dates. Millions should be on universal credit by now and it's only a few thousand.
Most of the benefits that are being rolled into it are altered every year by the relevant department. With universal credit the idea is that those claiming it send in information every month. It's sort of difficult to alter every benefit in that time scale.
The main problem is that IDS will not tell people what is going wrong so nobody can help him. That's what the case was about. He's probably hoping that he gets voted out at the next election, so he can blame the next person for the mess.

I don't understand the problems that people are having with Universal Credit. As I understand it, the system was very cumbersome and needed streamlining and simplifying.

I can see that it is fraught with difficulties as there are so many complicated issues and payments which are being combined into one main payment.

As I have never managed to claim anything, even when I was unemployed I would need someone with experience of the system to explain to me what is wrong with the new system, please. I have found this but all it does is lay out the basics. It doesn't explain what is causing all the worry.

Back to austerity, IDS has lost his appeal to keep things secret. Hopefully we will now be able to find out what a mess he's made of everything and the government will backtrack on some of its measures.
www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2014/06/26/ids-loses-legal-appeal-to-keep-universal-credit-problems-sec
Did someone say I lived in cloud-cuckoo land?

Nicely put, Pentstemmon. Everyone can contribute something to help those less fortunate than ourselves, even if it's only signing online petitions that aim to persuade the powers that be to act responsibly.

I have , since my teens, been regularly involved in protest and awareness raising about causes and political issues I am committed to. Sometimes this is via social media, letters to MPs & other significant people, financial donation, volunteering my time, boycotting goods/stores and also taking to the streets on demos /protests. I see this as a very important part of being a citizen of a democratic society (a British value maybe!).

It is a great shame that when people do choose to use their democratic right to peaceful protest it is overlooked and minimised by the press and often the general public too. A sign of political stagnation and indifference by the majority??

I do believe if some-one takes the time and trouble to apologise, it should accepted in a graceful manner !
IMO

I do feel it is so sad and unnecessary to make personal attacks on posters - the reason I post very rarely and only on dog/lighthearted subjects.

there have been austerity protest marches in Greece, Italy and Portugal

Now those I do remember seeing on the news!

and be able to do so without fear of being swept off their feet by a water cannon, should some troublemaker come along.

Oh blast - that's put a fly in the ointment. Maybe they could give a two minute warning before opening the valve?

I certainly did not know durhamjen's state of health - sorry, jen I can't read every single word you write and I missed that post. I don't see what's so unreasonable about asking someone if they'll be attending an event they are very keen to publicise.

Thanks, Holly.

It would be interesting to put this discussion alongside the thread about Boris buying water cannons. A peaceful protest march by seriously concerned citizens (and by the way, there have been austerity protest marches in Greece, Italy and Portugal) who caused no trouble and just wanted to make their collective views known. Gransnetters joined the People's Assembly and some will march again. Many people, young and old, went along to cheer the marchers on. On the water cannon thread, criticism was made about peaceful citizens being in the vicinity of protests - this thread demonstrates why citizens feel the need to protest, (and not be ignored by the media) and be able to do so without fear of being swept off their feet by a water cannon, should some troublemaker come along.

Thank you Holly

You do yourself or your cause no credit by posting in this manner GrannyTwice and no, you did not make me reflect.

I can't agree with your post GrannyTwice - I think it takes a lot for someone to publicly apologise and to dismiss the apology will make people reluctant to apologise in future and very often, an apology is all it takes to mend bridges - I would rather see an attempt at mending than just leaving them broken.

I do agree that conversations should be grown up but don't you lose the moral high ground once you begin to converse in negative ways?

I do, however, agree that Ana's comment wasn't particularly nasty - unless she knew jen's physical restrictions which she probably didn't. I had wanted to ask if people in wheelchairs (I know jen isn't in a wheelchair but it did make me wonder about the practicalities of it all) are not permitted to take part but was a tad bit concerned about being shot down in flames! Not all comments that are seen as 'nasty' were intended to be that way.

And another one!

Hello - jingle- yes I do. And since when do you have to contribute to a thread before you can criticise certain contributions? That's all some posters do anyway. As for plain nasty comments, the comments about are you going on the march etc weren't nasty at all. Anyway, my 4 month old dgs is due to arrive now and it will be refreshing to play with a grown- up

Well Aka you may well know all about personal attacks - and apologising now for the use of the word whingers is too little and too late and just doesn't cut it. It was that particular word which raised many hackles and there must have been a reason in your thinking that made you use it. It's a particularly unkind put- down sort of word which expressly says' what you are complaining about is of no import'
And Holly - I berated those people because they were being snide, unkind and childish. Sometimes, that's the only language people like that understand. It should be possible to have a grown up discussion about the march and lack of reporting but instead we got comments about are you going on the next march and if you really were committed you'd go from people who are extremely good at criticising those who actually have beliefs and act on them whilst never appearing to nail their colours to any particular mast but carp and criticise and belittle those who do. If I didn't come down to their level, then they'd just think it was ok to carry on - funnily enough, my comments do appear to have made Aka reflect

" Answers please on the back of a postage stamp"

Nasty

What I can't stand is when a poster makes hardly any contribution at all to the subject of the thread, but then posts several times criticising other people. That is plain nasty. And I'm sure you know who you are poster.

That's a lovely thing to do Aka and I'm sure they will appreciate that.

I'll ill

While I'm at it I will apologise for the use of the word 'whingers'. It was I'll advised and I ought to have used a less emotive word.

However strongly jen and eloethan feel about their cause, I'm sure they would want to distance themselves from any of their 'supporters' who express themselves in a way that is distasteful and verging on personal attacks.

I have to say that I agree with that comment - I find it puzzling that person A can berate person B by doing the very thing that they are berating them for.

I think there are others, apart from those you chose to name, who have kept trying to put forward their point of view in a civilised manner.

However strongly jen and eloethan feel about their cause, I'm sure they would want to distance themselves from any of their 'supporters' who express themselves in a way that is distasteful and verging on personal attacks.