NHS

www.euractiv.com/sections/social-europe-jobs/uk-anti-ttip-protests-focus-nhs-privatisation-303339

Someone likes the NHS and is prepared to say so.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/08/five-reasons-why-love-nhs-personal

I'm a fan of the NHS, despite the stranglehold on it currently. Various friends and loved ones are currently receiving excellent care via the NHS. On the other hand, a close friend didn't have a good experience in our local hospital.

This thread is going nowhere, except round in ever-decreasing circles. While the NHS is used as a political whipping boy by those who have their own agenda to push this is inevitable.

Well said Aka an open-minded public debate is what we need.

Don't bother writing on it, then, Aka.
pulsetoday.msgfocus.com/c/13Ht1gR54D1N5ipwgg4vujD

For anyone who has health checks, perhaps you should think of saving the NHS some money.

I have similar tales, Iam, some good and some bad, but, like you, I still do not want the NHS privatised, as it is being now.
The NHS is political. It was set up as a socialist ideal. That's why the Tories do not like it. It's not possible to get away from that fact.

Jen will you drop the politics and open your mind. We do not need link after link after b***y link to some perceived 'them and us' agenda.

A proper debate is becoming impossible, with you harking on and on and on ad nauseam.

ad nauseam is right, and BTW didn't we just have a similar thread about the NHS not long ago?

No, I will not drop the politics. Why should I?
You stop following me around, then you will not get upset by my politics.
The forum title, in case you are not aware, is politics. If you do not want politics do not read the politics thread. I did actually start this thread.

Well that says it all doesn't it?

Most of us don't see everything as a one-dimensional issue. You don't own a thread because you started it but when a view is so blatantly just being used to make a political point then I am quite entitled to comment in it, even if you don't like that.

Frankly I find this all very naive and I'm bored by the repetition of a hackneyed argument without anything positive to contribute.

The NHS will never achieve perfection. The NHS is like all large institutions at times wasteful, beaurocratic, permanently in need of more and more cash and at times run so badly it makes you weep. It has been in this state for years and probably will continue to do so.

We all probably have stories we can relate to that would show good / excellent service but equally other stories that are nothing short of malpractice, at times verging on manslaughter.

My personal experiences have pointed me in the direction that the service has infact improved in the area I live in but obviously others will disagree. We can however only speak honestly about our circumstances after all.

I

You can always start your open-minded public debate on the NHS on another thread, and leave me to my boring repetition of a hackneyed argument, Aka. I will not mind, really I won't. You can ask Ana to join you.

Exactly!!!

The forum title is "Politics".

Good post POGS and very true.

One of the problems, POGS, is that when you give anecdotal evidence, people then say it's not evidence based. I've found that on many websites.
I am never sure what they mean, as all evidence of outcomes in the NHS is based on individual treatment, i.e., anecdote.
I have moved round the country, living in lots of NHS areas. It is much worse now trying to get appointments. Never had this much trouble before.
I have to get a blood pressure monitor fitted tomorrow for the day. It has taken since Easter to get this arranged, with having to go and see various nurses and GPs for different things. It was definitely easier when the GPs did everything.

I think I'll follow your instruction to get off your thread Jen as it would seem that jingl endorses that too.

Just because Aka and I share the same opinion about some of your views, durhamjen, doesn't mean we're somehow in cahoots trying to sabotage 'your' thread. I resent that implication - and also the idea that just because you start a thread somehow makes it your own personal soapbox space...

It's a bit ridiculous telling me to drop the politics on a politics thread that I started. Even you must agree with that, Ana and Aka. Believe it or not, I do not just write for you two to disagree with me.

Our NHS used to be the envy of.... well, if not the world, then large parts of it. It was hard won, and IMO it should be hard fought for, not allowed to be eaten away. Do we really want a USA style health 'service'? I don't. We owe our lives to the NHS. And on a personal note, without it, I and DD2 would be dead. The fact is that the current government are doing very little to keep it going and invest in it in real terms. Perfect it ain't and doubtless there's wastage, and we have some real challenges in that we have an increasingly ageing population. I don't know what the answers are, but I am not prepared to allow the NHS to be dismantled. Aka, this IS political, whether you like it or not.

Well said, Rowantree. I nearly died last year, and would have done if it hadn't been for the NHS. If the same thing happens again, I'll get no warning.
So if I stop being political about the NHS, you'll know why!

You carry on beyond the grave, durhamjen. It makes my blood run cold to think that we could have little or no NHS within our lifetime. Do we really want to return to the days of paying every time we visit a doctor, with people being afraid of being ill? I'd hate to live under the American system, and I gather that it's not dissimilar in New Zealand - someone I know who has an ongoing serious health problem says she can't afford to keep going to the doctor! I have no idea about how the NZ system works, but I was shocked that she was asking for medical advice from online friends rather than paying out yet again for a medical appointment.
If we had a similar system, our family would be bankrupted several times over - DD2 was born with severe health problems and a rare syndrome, only recently diagnosed and named. Though we were let down with emotional/mental health support, the medical care she had was excellent and we were even able to travel from London to Sheffield Children's Hospital to access specialist orthopoedic surgery from a pioneering team - all free. Not in a million years would we have been able to afford that kind of care if we'd had to pay for it.
Durhamjen, I hope the NHS continue to give you the care you need, free at the point of delivery (or whatever the expression is!) I can't believe there are those prepared to allow it to be dismantled. And for what?

Oh, and another thing. It's a contentious issue, but I think it's worth remembering that we all DO pay for the NHS through taxes anyway, and that perhaps taxes should now be raised, partly to help fund the straining system. That wouldn't be popular, but it's fairer than dismantling the NHS. From each according to his(her) ability, to each according to his(her) need, etc...?

Its founding principle was that good healthcare should be available to all, regardless of wealth (or lack of it). I don't think we should abandon that.

Thanks, Rowan. I'll try to keep alive a bit longer just to annoy people.
My grandfather died before I was born because they could not afford medication for him. I cannot understand why people think this is acceptable in this age in this country. If this government gets in again the NHS will only be getting 6% of the GDP by 2021. We spend far less on the NHS than any comparable country, and, as you said, we were the envy of the world.
People in America and Australia are appalled at what this government is doing to the NHS. As you say, for what? So their friends can make a profit from the only business that where all the money used to go back into the care of the people that used it. And at the moment they can send those profits offshore so the NHS gets no benefit from the profits.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-28235850

Gap in NHS funding means free at point of use could come to an end in a few years.

Not entering the heated argument except to say that I am surprised to hear that people in Australia are appalled at what this government is doing to the NHS. From what I have heard (or not!) during visits to Australia they are not that aware or interested, and the majority of people I know over there pay into a private scheme as well as the public (Medicare) scheme. These work alongside each other and patients who pay into a private scheme can choose to use either as far as I am aware. Cost of drugs is subsidised but they are not free or subsidised to the extent that they are here.
Australians I have spoken to find our NHS, pensions and other benefits astonishingly generous!
I don't live there, of course, so can only speak as someone who has been on extended visits there (and had occasion to use their medical services a couple of times).