I might vote Tory but that doesn't make me a bad person

Not sure about the highly skilled bit. Some most definitely are. But a lot of them end up in costa coffee or on railway platforms just as an example. I suspect that a lot are middle, rather than high.

As no one has answered my question about voting for TB, I can only assume that people did, twice probably, and only saw afterwards, some of his, er credentials.

Day6 I like your post from previous page. People conveniently forget that the Labour government ( I won't call them Socialists) brought in tuition fees and academies , and ideas that took away creativity in primary schools .

^I might vote Tory but that doesn't make me a bad person.
It doesn't make you a good person either. In fact, it doesn't make you anything other than a Tory supporter^
And a person!! with hopes, dreams, feelings like anyone else.

It's the highly skilled workers that are coming in from the EU. We need them.

I was reading today that employers won't have to keep the workforce happy by giving decent pay rises because there is a plentiful supply of people who are willing to work for low pay coming in from the EU.

What surprised me is that it was in the Daily Mail!

The point is though that employers will create wealth on the backs of working men if they can get away with it.

Not against creation of wealth, against creating wealth on the backs of the working man by low pay, zero hour contracts, tax avoidance whilst their employees are taxed at source

The economy is always a problem for Labour's middle ground. In the past, they always somewhat shun creation of wealth. It comes across as being a bad thing to them. They have 40 or 50 years of image and probably realtity in that regard, to shake off.

Can I ask, apart from nightowl, who still voted for Tony Blair at the time? And the second time too.

Is it only with hindsight, that you saw what he was like, and not at the time you were voting for him?

David Miliband - it sounds to me that there is no hope of those two brothers making up anytime soon.
But even though he might not have liked what Ed did[personally I couldnt see much wrong with it, I dont go in for the, well David is older so he should be leader train of thought], he should not really have talked publically I dont think.
I pity their mum. Apparently she is distraught over it all, as it has split the family apart. And she did not want that.

I do find it refreshing thogh how MPs are finally being open about what they really think. It is so refreshing after all the spin and question avoidance, and sweeping under the carpet.

Eloethan. No caring person could disagree with these proposals. But it was their grasp/attitude towards the economy that turned people away.
My vote against them was because of the horrors in Rotherham, when they were in power, and, their attitude towards what was happening at Mid Staffs hospital.

Exactly, absent! So why the vilification for people who do vote conservative, such as 'vile Tory scum' etc? I am not sure I have ever seen posts on Social media saying things like that about people who vote for Labour, Greens, Libs.

I suppose you could always ignore it if it bores you

But who has got you babe?

Until 2020! Groundhog Day.

Yes, maybe we need a new show to watch, it's going round in circles now.

…with an equally tired and predictable plot "rosesarered*.

This thread is like The Mousetrap, it's going to run and run.

Why is David Millibands interview seen as revenge ? He spoke as a labour party member so every right to give his opinions on the party. It was the same when the new leader was elected, Ed stabbed David in the back, he did not. Two labour MP's who are brothers had different views on which way the party should go, David wanted to continue in Blairs footprints but Ed didn't so both stood for the leadership

I might vote Tory but that doesn't make me a bad person.

It doesn't make you a good person either. In fact, it doesn't make you anything other than a Tory supporter.

I don't blame David.
Revenge is a dish best served cold so they say (although I am not vengeful myself and am not a particular fan of DM).

He who occasionally goes by the name of Shapps is a goner.

Also agree with Eleothan - it all seems to have been a smear campaign to discredit him. Perhaps because he's the rather gentle type who won't retaliate.
I was active in local politics back in the 60s and 70s and I can tell you what the real Reds were like - we had some among our members. Real firebrands
Good old days?

No I suppose it was only a matter of time before David came back for his revenge though dj, wasn't it? Brotherly rivalry as well as ideological difference there.

Oh dear I've only just come back to this thread. I agree with GT (again) that Alan Sugar is not my idea of a senior Labour politician, (ex) Lord or not. I have to agree with Eloethan that so called 'Red Ed's' policies don't seem at all extreme to me. And to my mind, Tory-lite Tony Blair tried to please the moderates so much that he forgot that Labour was in fact a socialist party. Didn't Margaret Thatcher describe TB as her greatest achievement?

I do wish these people like TB, Mandelson, Sugar etc would keep their mouths shut and allow the party to move forward and away from the nightmare of the TB years.

Don't think much to brother David putting the boot in either.

Do these proposals from Ed Miliband/the Labour Party constitute being "far left" policies?

protecting families from being exploited by bad landlords

stopping people who reside permanently in the UK from claiming non-dom status and having the benefit of a preferential tax system

stopping the sell off and fragmentation of the NHS

preventing the use of zero hours contracts for people working regular hours who under these contracts have virtually no employment rights

enforcing minimum wage laws to prevent employees from being exploited

forcing energy companies to reduce prices charged to customers when wholesale prices fall

They seem perfectly reasonable - and much needed - policies to me. They would have benefitted the vast majority of Britons, whereas many of the Conservative policies will benefit only a small number of people.

I too am disgusted at the way some people in the party have turned on Ed Miliband. And it's funny how Alan Sugar didn't disassociate himself from the Labour Party before they lost. He seems to have been hedging his bets and has now decided that he'll fare better if he cosies up to the "winning team", and no doubt he will.

Blair and Mandelson have more in common with the Conservative Party since their main focus now appears to be the acquisition of money, power and friends in high places.