EU citizens living in UK.

It's not an anomaly. It's one thing to give someone the right to vote in local elections if that's where they live and pay council tax etc., but if they're not UK citizens why should they have the right to decide how the country is run?

In which case why would those of us who are UK citizens not have the right to vote? Cannot back both horses here - many of us still pay a lot of UK tax.

Because they live in the UK and pay tax and NI?
It must be an anomaly. Iif you think it's okay for them to vote for the council if they pay council tax, it should also be okay for them to vote for the government if they pay government tax.

jen marrying a UK citizen does not confer citizenship and the right to vote.

If someone comes here and marries a UK citizen, they have to live here for 5 years and apply for indefinite leave to remain, just like anyone else. The only difference is that they can then apply for citizenship straight away, whereas people not married to UK citizens have to wait another year.

The UK does not require people to give up their own citizenship, so I don't see what the problem is.

www.commonwealthimmigration.com/uk_citizenship_naturalization_visa_immigration.html

You give the example of someone living and working here for 20 years having to pay £1600 - that's less than £2 per week for the privilege of becoming a citizen of what is still one of the best democracies, and most tolerant societies in the world, however much you may disagree with that.

Have you seen the forms, jane, and the citizenship tests?
It seems to me they are designed to put people off applying.
You do not pay £2 per week, do you? You pay the full amount, and have to give your bank account details before you fill in the rest of the form.
It gives the impression that the money is the most important thing.

At the moment, jane, Danes abroad cannot have dual nationality. The person I am talking about would have to give up her birth nationality to have UK nationality. It changes in September.

www.danes.dk/en/advocacy/dual-citizenship/

There are six other countries in the EU that do not allow it, either, but I do not know which ones.

jen
"To vote in a UK general election a person must be registered to vote and also:
be 18 years of age or over on polling day
be a British citizen, a qualifying Commonwealth citizen or a citizen of the Republic of Ireland
not be subject to any legal incapacity to vote"

This is from the Electoral Commission.
www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registration/who-is-eligible-to-vote-at-a-uk-general-election

Just because some countries don't allow their citizens to have dual citizenship is no reason to change our own standards, in my opinion.
Citizenship confers rights and privileges, one of which is to vote in General Elections, and I don't see why we should allow non-citizens to vote, simply because the country of their birth restricts them from having dual citizenship.
Even the USA, not the most liberal of countries, allows dual citizenship.

Our own standards change all the time, jane. One of my grandchildren had to take his mother's nationality, until this year when it changes in September. His sister could be either as she was born after the cut off date.
Two of his cousins were born before the cut off date to make them have their mother's nationality so one could have dual, but the other could not but could take her father's nationality.
So over 22 years the rules on nationality have changed at least four times.

My ex-daughter in law had three passports, one of them US. If she went to the US and used her UK or Norwegian passport, she was always asked why she did not use her US one, and asked lots of questions at customs. Might allow dual citizenship but treats foreigners with suspicion.

"To vote in a UK general election a person must be registered to vote and also:
be 18 years of age or over on polling day
be a British citizen, a qualifying Commonwealth citizen or a citizen of the Republic of Ireland
not be subject to any legal incapacity to vote"

I cannot register in the UK because I don't live there, although I do own property there, but otherwise I fulfil the criteria. While I would certainly argue that those who don't pay tax should not be disenfranchised, those of us who do pay tax and live in some other country are disenfranchised and this seems unfair to me.

Having said that, I am quite glad I didn't have to vote in the last General Election.

absent I would have thought you would be entitled to register to vote unless you left the UK over 15 years ago
Family in Australia were entitled to vote but did not as they felt it was not right as they do not live here.

www.aboutmyvote.co.uk/register-to-vote/british-citizens-living-abroad

EU citizens living in the UK can vote in EU elections, i.e., for MEPs. So what's the difference between that and the in/out referendum?
Surely if they can vote for an MEP, they should be able to vote for whether we have MEPs.

Absent you can register to vote in UK - you can fill in the form online and give your NI number amongst other answers. You are registered in the constituency you last lived. Then you can download and fill in application form for either a postal vote or appoint a proxy. This form you then send to the Electoral office in the constituency. You can do this o the one election or on a permanent basis till you wish to change instructions.

jen Your OP asked whether EU citizens living in the UK should have the right to vote in the in-out EU referendum.
You implied that because they could vote for MEPs, that gave legitimacy to the idea of their voting in the referendum.

I disagree. They would be able to vote for an MEP if they were living in their country of origin, so it is not unreasonable for them to vote for one if they are living in the UK.

But they would not be able to vote in a UK general election. Only UK citizens can do that. If we have to have a referendum, and I wish we weren't having one, I think the qualifications to vote in it should be the same as for general elections.

I agree with janea

Why not get the whole of Europe to vote on whether they would like us to stay in the EU? That could be interesting!

If someone is not allowed dual nationality then that is because their country of origin will not allow it. If there are no restrictions to them being granted British citizenship then they would be allowed to hold dual nationality. It is their country of origin which should be lobbied regarding this, it is not a fault of the UK.

djen I am pleased that the rules are changing (was that from the link on the other thread?)

I think so, roseq. But only for my grandson, not for his mother.

I disagree with you, janea. I think anyone who has paid all the taxes they should and has family who are British and lives in the UK should be able to vote, those who have made the UK their home for six or more years, as they have shown commitment.
However, as I said, it will be Cameron who decides and it will depend on whether he thinks that EU citizens living in the UK will support him or not.

I suppose his mother's nationality is a matter for the Danish government. I hope they will relax the rules (I cannot see why not if it is another European country).

Which has given me a thought - what about Princess Mary of Denmark? (so beloved of the Australians) - will the Danish government grant her and her children Danish nationality?

Australian magazines are always full of their very own Princess!

The Danish parliament passed a special law called ‘Mary’s Law’ giving Mary Danish citizenship upon her marriage. The royal had previously held dual citizenship of Australia and the United Kingdom

Presumably she had to give up her Australian and British citizenship!

We now know that EU citizens living in the UK will not be able to vote in the referendum. However, it's amazing how many people not resident in the UK will be able to.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/may/22/only-british-citizens-vote-eu-referendum

I agree that some of the categories of who can vote in GE is somewhat odd but I feel that saying the EU referendum will be based on those categories is acceptable. EU citizens living here can apply for citizenship if they wish and if they don't, not having a vote seems a fair consequence. I would normally be ambivalent about UK citizens living abroad being allowed to vote under the 15 year rule ( I think 15 years is too long ) but I'm guessing that all those retirees in Spsin, France etc are much more likely to vote to stay in so I'm relaxed ( as they say) about that. I'm much much more interested in how this is going to pan out - will DC get enough concessions to spin into promoting a stay in vote? Will Murdoch et al support him? What will his swivel eyed lot on the back benches do? My opinion, FWIW, is that he'll not get an out out from free movement of labour but some concessions on benefits. That might take some spinning

That's what I am going to tell my son's partner, that there are more UK citizens living abroad who would want us to stay in than there are EU citizens like her.
I really cannot see Cameron getting many concessions. I think it is seen as a bit of a joke in the EU.
It will be interesting also to see if May gets her control of the BBC through. A good bit of censorship might help them.

From what I have read of the matter, I don't think the rest of the EU see it as a bit of a joke at all, in fact far from it ( our referendum to stay in/out of the EU.)I think it is seen as potentially very serious by them and wouldn't be at all surprised If David Cameron does get the concessions that he wants.The free movement of workers may be a sticking point, but if there are no benefits for years and years and jobseekers have to leave within six months if no jobs can be found, then that will limit the free movement anyway.