The Summer Budget

Talk about not living up to expectations. Osborn's budget, now that the pundits have been able to look at it in depth are beginning to be extremely critical. From the IFS to the Church and economists - it is difficult to know where to start with it all. There is many issues that they could almost each be dealt under separate headings. Here are just a few:-
1.Our grandchildren's prospects have declined across the board since this government took office by at least 10%. This includes education, housing, health , income and debt.
2. Our fictious low income family will whilst already being unable to make ends meet be pushed even further down the income scale. 3million of the poorest families will loose £1000 per year.
3. The number of young people people out of work is 3 times higher than that of Germany.The consequences of denying opportunities to our young will be felt over the subsequent years.
4. We as the elderly have continually profited from this government at the expense of the young and the inequality between the generations is growing. Some see this as a major moral issue.
5. There no moral argument that leaves the under 25's out of the minimum wage rise.
6. The bottom 30% have totally lost out from this and previous budgets. Whilst the top 20% have been hardly touched, in fact have gained.
7. Osborne's rhetoric in 2010 promising that the deficit would be reduced to 35bn by now was not deliverable, something which he failed to understand. Now we shall see how the surplus shapes up in 2020.

I agree with Gracesgran. I also find the self-congratulatory tone rather wearisome but, I suppose, predictable. The older generation, on the whole, has always said that the younger generation aren't as responsible/thrifty as they were.

As Gracesgran says, we are living in a very different world now. There is a multi-billion pound marketing sector that uses sophisticated techniques to induce people to buy, there is the easy availability of credit (which continues unabated despite the financial crash) and there is very little opportunity to get electrical or mechanical goods repaired so they have to be replaced. Is it any wonder that young people tend to have a different mindset from older people.

Why need electricity when people can use candles like the good old days , but of a problem cooking on a coal fire with no fireplace though

I agree that things were very different then, and attitudes were different. I don't remember anyone patronising or being condescending to me when DH was made redundant and things were financially very tricky, and I don't think anyone here is doing this either, just pointing out that hard times are not something new, and that each generation has its own way of coping and that it is amazing what you can do even surprising yourself in the process! There were certain bills that had to be paid, as I think a lot of us war/post war children were brought up to view debt as something to be very wary of and kept strictly under control. That which you couldn't comfortably afford you simply went without in the hopes that things would improve when that job, applied for umpteen times finally appeared, and the fill in job could go!!
I frankly didn't care what I did to help make ends meet, the pay was always iffy, but you made new friends, and helped yourself as best you could with the minimum of fuss.

Picking up on some of Anya's points; we were in a more fortunate position than she was but even so, DH was just starting out in first paid post after 6 years on grants and scholarships when DS1 was born and I gave up paid work. But everyone passed on baby's and children's clothes, ate left-overs and took a picnic to the park for the exciting outing. Bus ride on the top deck! Feeding the ducks! Choosing a book at the library! It's right that every generation should aspire to do better than the one before and that parents hope their children will have secure and happy lives. But I feel the aspirations may often be based on false values. When TV interviewees talk of deprivation, they often refer to not having holidays or not being able to take the children on trips or buy them things.

I've said this on another thread so sorry to repeat myself and bore everyone but back in the day the corner shops fed the poorer people in our communities.

Everything was on 'the bill', pay day in our area was Thursday so the bill was paid, a basic order purchased then off they went again. The corner shop was the pantry until the following week. Most had gas and electric meters so a shilling for the gas was not unusual on a Wednesday, on the bill of course. These weren't feckless people, on the contrary they were hard workers in a traditionally low payed industry.

The advent of the supermarket and the demise of the corner shop took this option away. It wasn't the best way to live but it did keep people fed.

Not self satisfied. Just looking back on how we dealt with hard times (which we didn't even think were hard times at the time). Resilience and different expectations were key. How are current youngsters dealing with it?

This thread is beginning to drip with condescension. The "our generation was better than this one" club seems to be back. Solutions may differ but the vast majority of the "younger generation" try just as hard to make ends meet but they are coping with a different world - just as the vast majority of ours coped with a different world to our parents - although in our case it was much improved from the past.

I am beginning to feel even more sympathy for those younger people who have a go at the self-satisfied older generation.

I am talking generally. I dont think that any large group of people can be lumped totally together.

I dont think I was necessarily thinking of aspirations.
More a case of do they think that their situation is hopeless, if that makes sense.

The unemployment rate is maybe less than it used to be.

But on the other hand, I think it is safe to say that the divide between rich and poor is wider.

Aspirations?

I think though, that back then, there were also the ideals of being able to get out of your situation.

Do poorer people have those ideals now?

Good points about resilience and expectations.

I'd forgotten the late Saturday shop Niggly. As you reminded me nothing opened on Sunday so there were good bargains to be had if you timed it right. And the butcher would give you a ham bone 'for the dog' free, which boiled up for pea and ham or ham and lentil soup, often with good bits of ham left on it.

Broken biscuits! Had forgotten those too.

Yes, we were young and creative and knew how to peel vegetables and eek meals out for days. And not too proud to eat leftovers.

Some of the people who use food banks do not have the money for fuel, so mince would be useless to them.
They are given items that do not need cooking.

I remember having a recipe book called 'left overs for tomorrow' that had umpteen ways to use mince, bulking it out with pasta,lentils, even chickpeas if you were feeling really poor!!Dumplings, for both savoury dishes and puddings were on the menu. No I wouldn't have used a food bank, but I certainly went to the supermarket late on Saturday evening, (before Sunday opening) as there were often good bargains to be had. Also the local weekly market, again if you or a friend could get there late in the afternoon there were more bargains. I remember buying broken biscuits very cheaply, great for kids and again jelly with a biscuit base was a favourite in our house, cheap and easy, and we were young with energy that now eludes me!!

And I expect Jane, Niggly and Roses because many were in the same boat we didn't actually think of it as anything other than normal, especially with young families. I think children definately had less expectations and were happy for trips to the beach, local park, swimming pool, other people's houses.

Do you feel you would have qualified to use a food bank, if they had been in existence, Anya?

Yes, in the recession of the early 80s DH's business went under and we had to sell our lovely house and downsize considerably. We has two young children and I was, luckily working full time.

DH had to get a job, any job, to stretch our reduced income so we could feed the family and pay the mortgage. He worked long hours in a poorly paid, dead end job until something better came along.

No help from state or any other handouts. Like you niggly friends passed on clothes and we shared child minding, school runs, etc..

Eating out meant going around to each other's houses for a home made curry. We swapped recipes and reckoned we could write a book called 101 recipes with mince!

Good post niggllynellie, I think that was probably true for a lot of us.

We too have had some pretty hairy financial times in the last 51 years. Apart from family allowance (only for the second and subsequent children) there was, as far as I was aware, no additional state help, and it never occurred to us that there should be. For me a pressure cooker was an essential, as was a sewing machine. Friends helped and supported each other, most of us in the same boat, exchanging children's clothes, chipping in for the odd day out, with the kids, child minding to enable part time work, and, most important, having a lot of laughs, and also tears. It could be a challenge, but I remember lots of happy times with very little money. I guess expectations now are a lot higher and what was for us an aspiration is now a 'must have'.

There's something about expectations though. I think previous governments have fostered a widespread expectation of state (taxpayer funded ) aid. I never said we were miserable btw. Everyone else was in the same boat. The situation then fostered the development of innovative solutions to coping. Maybe this current approach will do the same? I hope so.

Well, you know Jane most people have always "managed" - if by that you mean they go on living, even if miserably.

There are probably lots of people on Gransnet - myself and my husband included - who have lived through similar times to yourself. My husband was a student nurse when we first married and we lived very frugally. Just because times were difficult for us, I don't begrudge other people getting some assistance when times are tough. In any case, some aspects of life forty or so years ago were easier. Buying or renting a home, for instance, did not take up such a large proportion of a person's income.

Sorry to go on about it but its got me thinking. Despite redundancies ++ in the 80s and very frightening times including our house being on the line to help set up a new business we somehow managed without any taxpayer funded state aid. I had to work full time. No choice. No free child care. No help. But we managed. Massive strain on relationship. Opting our would have been easier. But we just put up with it like thousands of others. There's something about resilience here. I fully realise that this is anecdotal but, like other anecdotes mentioned here, it is illustrative of a large cohort of the electorate who rarely give voice to their concerns. Don't forget about us.