IDS - work is good for your health

The striking through was not meant to be there!

Been out most of the morning and just caught up here -- I have read those links you posted Jen it is almost unbelievable in this day and age that people should fund their sick pay!! With the earnings of so many people either going down or failing to keep pace with inflation it is hard enough for some people to scrape by without trying to save incase they are sick. One article talks about someone getting a cold type of infection - if they feel they have to go to work it is unlikely they will do an efficient job except being efficient with spreading their germs to co-workers - anyone with asthma or another chest complaint getting a cold can be really serious. The whole thing is ridiculous. He must stay up all night thinking these mad ideas up. Why do they not just come out and say we want to go back to a medieval system and having many serfs.

This all ties in with the need for many more jobs being needed - but we have a skills shortage in many areas - much caused by ithe stopping of apprentice schemes -- don't get me started on that - or the National Curriculum!!!!

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/dwp-staff-given-suicide-guidance-ahead-of-iain-duncan-smiths-welfare-reforms-10470754.html

IDS has at last recognised that people sanctioned might commit suicide; otherwise he would not feel the need to issue this guidance. Of course, it's not anything to do with IDS, as he said about the falsified leaflets.

I read it in the same way as FarNorth, Anya, but then I would, wouldn't I?

If you are going to be rude to people, at least spell the word correctly.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/aug/25/work-cure-disability-benefits-sickness

IDS thinks that those who are ill should pay for it, and Cameron agrees that it's a good idea.

Fools rush in so here goes, possibly Anya who has been as much a victim of mental illness as the sufferer has learned at a young age a way to cope with it.

No Anya, not people like you, people who in 2015 still tell those with mental illness to get a grip and pull themselves together , who claim it's an easy way to receive benefits , who think suffers of severe depression just need to get out and have a brisk walk no matter that brushing their hair exhausts them

Then read it again in the right spirit FarNorth

It's nice to see that there's one rule for 'buddies' and another for others.

You can all just buggar off as far as I'm concerned.

Anya your questions came across as disbelieving rather than plain requests for information.

Your comment re Anniebach shows you have jumped to a (possibly mistaken) conclusion, something for which you castigate others.

....that should read 'my younger sister and I'

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I do admire VQ, the more we speak out the more it will sink in with people that it is not a life style choice to gain benefits but a daily battle with an illness that is so debilitating

Welshwife, I agree with you. I think that those who know someone are best placed to give information on that person's ability or otherwise.
The government changed it.

Grannyknot, I do not understand what you are getting at. Doctoring figures might be as old as the hills, although the benefit system isn't. It does not make it right, does it? We've always done it, so that's okay then. Is that what you are saying?

for vq - and lots of admiration for being so honest and open about your problems. I am glad that you feel GNet is a safe enough place to do so.

I would.

I wish I could be really unkind and wish one week of what VQ and many others suffer upon IDS and his supporters, I wouldn't wish one day of this hell on them

You've just got to believe it Anya - elderly people do have mental health problems that result in self-harm; cases like those outlined by Eleothan do happen.

I have been to so many tribunals and discussions with benefits agency and believe me it all happens.

The staff are under pressure to reduce the number of claimants and can be harsh, dismissive, rigid and generally unpleasant. Some, of course, have the maturity and intelligence to approach their task with humanity, but many do not. They too are in the bind of being in a stressful job with political bods breathing down their necks to achieve the results they want.

I've copied and pasted your two questions, Anya, so that I don't misquote you.

"What on earth condition would make someone rip their arms to pieces?"
In my case take your pick from:
Depression
Anxiety
Emotionally Unstable Personality Disorder
PTSD
Social Anxiety Disorder

"Surely not at 'our age'?"
Yes, at our age. In fact at any age. You seemed surprised. Self harmers often hide the fact they do it. After all it's not 'normal' is it and they don't want to draw attention to their 'abnormalities'. I hid my scars for years. Now I see them as evidence of my will to survive.

Like many people with mental health problems I have conditions that will never go away. I may have good days but I also have many many bad days. I cannot cope outside the house without having someone I trust with me (usually DH who has had to give up work to be my carer). This is every day. I haven't been out of the house alone since 14th November 2011. Assessments for benefits are usually done by people who have no expertise in mental conditions. In fact many have no understanding of mental conditions whatsoever.

You say you don't believe things simply because they're from the newspapers. I understand that but now you're getting your information from someone who is inside the benefits system. I'm not a one off case. There are lots of us out there who's health is damaged even further by the constant search for the minority of fraudsters.

If you are accused of a crime in this country you are deemed innocent until proven guilty. If you are ill you are deemed to be a fraudster until you prove your innocence.

That's the other side of the coin Deedaa, those, like your husband, who would like to work and can't. I know a quadriplegic who holds down a responsible job, but that's thanks to the understanding of a good employer. Recently a government funded scheme, near us, which employed mainly people with disabilities was closed down. That is such short term thinking as those people will now need financial support and, just as importantly, have lost the company and friendship of work colleagues, their feelings of being able to do something constructive and the day to day structure of their lives.

These are some of the positives which can make working better for many people, rather than being stuck at home all day.

The treatment of seriously ill people can be disgraceful - somebody who has worked for years who gets ill should not be put through any of these 'tests' - it is inhumane - there should be some code which prevents the need for these poor people needing to go through these things.
DJ it may well be that people who deal with a person regularly are deemed biased but if that is the case it is actually insulting to the professional. A second opinion maybe, but the views of the people with much knowledge of the person/claimant/patient should still be taken into account.

Dj you make it sound as if doctoring figures is a new thing. It's one of the oldest tricks in the book.

Vox Political has had freedom of information requests to get the information out of the government about the number of people who have died after being sanctioned. The figures are supposed to be out this Friday. They are being doctored so that they cannot be compared to any other set of figures, and put out when parliament is not sitting and just before the bank holiday, a time for government to bury figures they do not want to be noticed.

To be fair there are people who would feel better if they were working, but suffering from a long term illness makes them pretty much unemployable. My DH would have been happy to get back to some sort of work but as someone only a couple of years off retiring, with an incurable cancer thast means he is not fit enough for anything physically demanding and is liable to suddenly be hospitalised with infections he is not top of anyone's list of desirable employees. No amount of government encouragement or coercion is going to change this.

I thought they stopped that because they thought the GP or whoever would be biased in favour of the disabled person.
My husband was disabled. I had to go with him, and be with him every time a strange doctor came to our house to watch him crawl up and down the stairs, and pick things up from the floor and fall over.
He was reminded all the time of how he got his disability because he had to fill in forms with exactly the same information for ten years.
It's humiliating.
The thing is that people with disabilities like to put a good gloss on things. They do not all cheat, but you would not think so when you see what spouts from the government.

I did know that DJ but she is sitting on a panel and the people they see are not actually known to the assessors - I am suggesting that a professional person, who actually knows the person being assessed, should also be involved and give their view as to the current health - mental or physical situation. if they give input to the panel they will have a much more in depth and wider knowledge base to make a fair decision - hopefully drastically cutting down the number of appeal cases too.
This business where people with long term serious or terminal illness have money stopped is a disgrace.