Labour Leadership watch

No, you do not get it, POGS.
It's not prejudice, it's the fact that Blair cannot be trusted. It's not to do with Corbyn. Brown is a decent person, a socialist, who can be trusted. Blair is not. That's all.
Some people might have changed their vote from Corbyn because of what Brown said. They certainly would not change their vote because of Blair insulting them yet again.

Oh I get it there is a total dislike / prejudice (hatred) for Blair from the far left of the party but why is Brown not being chastised for his stance on voting for Corbyn?

In other words we all know the personal views you have on their character but what about the debate re Corbyns election and what they have both intimated, Blair spoke outrightly Brown took the route of not speaking the words but left nobody in doubt he was warning against voting for Corbyn and declared his backing for Cooper.

That's it Jen, Blair isn't a socialist, Gordon is , I don't believe Gordon was ever comfortable with new labour, his speech concentrated on winning power and yes I think Corbyn would have a far more difficult time fighting the Tory party, tory press, big businesses and I'm alright jack voters . I am prepared to wait and see how the young generation responds to socialism , they have no experience of it

POGS, difficult to explain, Blair is concerned with his legacy living on, Gordon has concerns for different reasons. Who ever is leader will not be all things to all members. Blair has given his support to a candidate, Gordon has not. Same when the Tory party chooses a new leader , they are not united in their choice

POGS doesn't get it either, Anniebach.

One's a socialist, the other isn't?

I'm confused. Both Tony Blair and Gordon Brown have said don't vote for Corbyn.

Apart from personal prejudice/dislike why is one being feted and the other the devil if the discussion is about the Labour Leadership election.

trisher, does the man not understand the Labour Party is a socialist party not a watered down Tory party , if I wanted to support a watered down Tory party I would vote for the Libs . All this rubbish about splitting the party, didn't work for Shirley Williams and David Owen did it , they tried and failed

I presume you voted before you went, whitewave. Have a lovely holiday. Hope the results are what you want when you get back.

Well said Anniebach. I think the louder Tony shouts the more people like Corbyn. He just reminds us that the Labour party was hijacked by a career politician who had no respect for its values, or for the views of the people he was leading.

Does he not realise many party members are not listening to him just as he didn't listen to many party members who marched against going into
Iraq. He was wrong then . We want socialist values back in the party Tone, we are sick of greed is good so sod the vulnerable which was thatchers politics and which have been taken up by the present Thatcherite government

I don't know if you will see this whitewave but have a lovely time.

At least his last paragraph recognises that maybe people are utterly cheesed off with the way the UK and the ROW is going, and being run. This is the minimum the I am hoping the JC effect will achieve. We can't go on as we are, from what we are doing to the natural world, to the disaster that is the middle East and north africa, resulting in suffering beyond endurance.
The austerity packages that the poor are enduring in order to dance to the tune of the wealthy. Watching what the poor as tax payers have helped to build, from libraries, decent schools, health service, good roads, social care etc etc all being run down, by the wealthy whose friends in the city caused the biggest recession since the 30s, and being told we are all in this together. I don't see many wealthy people at a food bank, or struggling to find the rent. Good for them for doing well in life, but please understand that being in it together sometimes mean making a bit of a sacrifice just as the poor are doing. The trouble is that being wealthy or even reasonably well off wraps you in a rather comfortable bubble, which is fine, but doesn't allow you to see what is happening to so many in this country and indeed the world. But perhaps they don't care?

Anyway I am taking a break now for a couple of weeks, so everyone take care, keep well and I will speak to you when I get back about who won!!!!!!!!??????

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/aug/29/tony-blair-labour-leadership-jeremy-corbyn

Tony Blair has got in on the act again, by insulting all Corbyn's supporters. Does he not realise yet that every time he opens his mouth Corbyn's chances improve?

Not really, it's all subjective.

But Corbyn will negotiate with his friends in the EU and stay in there to help reform it. Corbyn does things by negotiation. So refreshing.
Cameron does not have that many friends and he's told everyone he will leave if he does not get what he wants.
Surely you must be able to see the difference.

So he is PRO EU.

What negotiations / reforms does Corbyn want.?

To be honest the quote you gave sounds absolutely no different to Cameron's words. I haven't got much of a clue what he wants to negotiate either.

I don't know any party that does not say the EU needs reform. So what happens if Cameron/Corbyn (if elected) doesn't get reform?

Thanks dj

Jeremy Corbyn has pledged to join forces with EU allies to create a “better Europe”, making it clear he has no plans to abandon Britain’s membership of the union.

As a private poll released to the Daily Mirror suggested the leftwinger had widened his lead in the Labour leadership contest, Corbyn clarified his stance on the EU under pressure from pro-EU Labour MPs.

In a statement released to the Guardian, Corbyn said: “Labour should set out its own clear position to influence negotiations, working with our European allies to set out a reform agenda to benefit ordinary Europeans across the continent. We cannot be content with the state of the EU as it stands. But that does not mean walking away, but staying to fight together for a better Europe.”

Corbyn made clear that he intended to campaign for reform from within the EU after Phil Wilson and Pat Glass, the two MPs who chair the parliamentary Labour party’s 100-strong pro-EU group, wrote to him asking that he make clear whether he supported EU membership.

I'll get back to you on that as I have only read what I have said. I expect dj knows. But remember he only has 1 vote like the rest of us, and there are yes and noers from all parties, so it isn't really something to get your knickers in a twist about.
I am feeling demob happy as listening to Glen Miller on the proms and going on holiday tomorrow

By the way I have only ever seen the left as in Labour over the last decade be nothing other than PRO Europe.

It was so evident Labour has been fighting Cameron over Europe. So many times Labour has given PRO Europe interviews and speeches.

Sorry WW I will leave the winding up to others.

I have asked a perfectly good question.

You have answered it . I shall be reminded of your words that Corbyn is happy to stay in Europe but what 'criteria' is he seeking for staying in.?

Oh pogs you doing all this to wind us up I just know you are. You know as well as I do that JC is content to stay in Europe provided certain criteria are met, rather like the rest of us. And yes the left wing have traditionally been against Europe, just like the right wing.

Question

I thought Corbyn sang from the Tony Benn pages when it came to the EU.

Now I am reading reports that make me believe he has had a change of heart and is pro EU.

Can somebody elaborate was he always pro EU or have I made a mistake.

I expect if JC doesn't win he will still be around - he has been for the last thirty years or so. But campaigning against war and for fairness doesn't make you particularly popular with the mainstream media and usually means that you will be ignored.