Gransnet forums

News & politics

Cameron - friend of Muslim women?

(409 Posts)
JessM Mon 18-Jan-16 18:30:57

In his latest foray the PM has announced that he's putting up some more cash for Muslim women to learn English. So far so good. But on the other hand threatening to deport them if they don't get their act together. And implying that non-English speaking mothers are something to do with terrorism.
Baroness Warsi has called this announcement : lazy and misguided.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35345903

This is not the first time ESOL training has come up since the 2010 election.

blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-osbornes-english-lessons-are-no-threat/13776
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-13412811

Jalima Sun 24-Jan-16 17:01:47

As my friend's mother used to say to her (in her Yorkshire accent), 'oh, do give over Mary!'

Same thing really, but in Welsh grin

thatbags Sun 24-Jan-16 16:51:03

Most of what we all write on GN is unnecessary. I don't think necessariness is a good measure for Gransnet forums smile

I don't find the phrase "give it a rest" provocative. It's usually used in response to provocation rather than it doing the provoking. That's how I see it anyhow.

Jalima Sun 24-Jan-16 15:25:12

Not as provocative as some posts though!

Wilma I don't think TEFL/CELTA teachers come cheap either.

Eloethan Sun 24-Jan-16 15:06:02

Unnecessary and provocative Luckylegs.

Luckylegs9 Sun 24-Jan-16 08:02:33

The Welsh for give it a rest "roi cynnig gorffwys" please keep it for future reference.

WilmaKnickersfit Sat 23-Jan-16 22:14:43

Anniebach I apologise for my comment about grumppa.

Jalima how the women will be found to let them know about classes will be a challenge and one that may eat into the £20 million. After the government cut the £400 million for Adult Education in 2012, most of the infrastructure was dismantled. Until then there would have been a network for lots of different groups in local community that would be used as a stepping stone for new initiatives. That's why I posted before about my concern that a lot of the money will be spent getting classes off the ground. It can be done, but not without spending money and trust me when I said £20 million sounds like a lot of money, but it's not with an initiative like this. Remember too it's a fund, so how the money will be released will be important. It might cost a lot more in one area to enable a small number of women to benefit from the money, than in an area with higher number of women.

Iam64 Sat 23-Jan-16 19:09:13

Jalima, you've prompted me to have a bit of a moan about the impact of the cuts on Sure Start and other family centres, some run by local authorities some by charities. Many of them provided space for health visitors and midwives to run various clinics. this meant there was an instant link to family centre groups and support services. My experience was this tended to increase attendance by groups of parents who weren't "referred" by social workers. Two of the centres I was involved with served deprived areas where there were relatively large Pakistani Muslim communities. You'd get young mums with no English attending the baby clinics, they'd be encouraged to attend groups or get their toddlers into the free nursery places available. The result of this was win win, especially as it meant a mix of people from the local community i.e. Pakistani, Polish, white British and the occasional black British parent. They also ran groups for dads, including single parents. Those centres would be ideal places for English language groups - oh yes they ran them…...

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 18:24:48

That is the other thing, and how will they get to know about it?

petra Sat 23-Jan-16 18:20:23

Are there any numbers of how many Muslim women might want this 'service'?

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 18:03:05

Would there be enough ESOL teachers or would a lot more have to be trained?
There are a lot of British ESOL teachers but many of them are working overseas.

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 18:01:05

Wish I had never mentioned bloodyWales now, having read all the posts, shouldn't reply to them as I go through the thread hmm

Probably roi seibiant i ni is nearest Terribull

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 17:49:58

Not at all worried , just dislike racism no matter the race

Yes, I agree with that absolutely.
Which is why being in a minority where I live can be uncomfortable on rare occasions, but it has happened.

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 17:44:29

5% of the UK population is in Wales and 20% of the Welsh population speak Welsh
As I said in my previous post not all the population of Wales is Welsh; some of them will not speak English or Welsh.

If posters think that everyone who lives in Wales is Welsh, then the logical conclusion from that would be that Wales is an extremely unwelcoming place for immigrants from the rest of the UK and overseas.

Jalima Sat 23-Jan-16 17:38:32

There are 64 million people living in the UK and 3 million are Welsh. Is that plain enough.
That is a nonsense; yes, there are just over 3 million people living in Wales, some of whom are English, Irish, Scottish or other nationalities. There are very, very many Welsh people living in England and other parts of the UK (probably more than there are in Wales).

mcem Sat 23-Jan-16 17:30:12

I genuinely tried to say just that (though not in Welsh) but my concern has been dismissed out of hand.
I have often found ab s posts interesting and was not 'having a go' but I am now bowing out.

Elegran Sat 23-Jan-16 17:28:38

Let's all get back to to the English classes for furriners - or let the whole thread rest for a while.

TerriBull Sat 23-Jan-16 17:16:52

I looked in on this thread this morning thinking it might have changed direction from last night back to the original theme and now I see several hours later, like a stuck record going round and round ad in finitum the "Welsh minority persecution complex" continues. Anyone know what's Welsh "for give it a rest"

Anniebach Sat 23-Jan-16 17:00:54

And another joins ,

mcem Sat 23-Jan-16 16:59:10

anniebach as one who has never posted either criticising or disagreeing with you I really do think you're doing yourself no favours with this. As a Scot, I could jump on your minority bandwagon but won't as it would achieve nothing and, more to the point, it has nothing to do with the op.
Please just stop and ask yourself if this has gone far enough and stop digging.

Anniebach Sat 23-Jan-16 16:42:33

Thank you grumppa, I will not wait for those who accused me of saying it to apologise , but I am grateful to you

grumppa Sat 23-Jan-16 16:07:24

Sorry not to have been around to defend myself, I had to go to Waitrose - there's an admission - and thanks to those stepped in on my behalf.

No, ab, you did not accuse me of racism, but I cannot see how what I wrote could be seen as an attack on free speech. I was trying to suggest that the minorities card can perhaps be overplayed, since it is one to which we can all have recourse if we try hard enough. But I would never suggest any minority should be denied free speech, only that it might lose the attention of its audience. In the wise words of a character in Asterix le Gaulois, "Bis repetita non placent toujours pas", I think. I cannot verify my references as my Asterix books are in tbe loft and I am in the King's Head.

thatbags Sat 23-Jan-16 15:57:46

Man the lifeboats! Abandon ship! It's the only way out!

Anniebach Sat 23-Jan-16 15:47:34

And that is a reason for the jibe from Jane10,

Elegran Sat 23-Jan-16 15:42:41

Well, posts from and to you have rather dominated the last bit of the thread, ab !

Anniebach Sat 23-Jan-16 15:38:42

You just couldn't leave me out of it could you Jane10 .