Have the cuts in funding gone to far?

This is an interactive map showing where cuts in bus services have happened.

bettertransportmaps.org.uk/map-bus-cuts-2015.html

Click on your county and it shows the cuts since 2010.

Well, that was in February 2015 obieone. By December 2015 Mail On Line This Is Money was reporting:

"A leading business group has downgraded its growth forecasts for the next three years because weak trade and manufacturing has left the UK's economy over-reliant on debt-fuelled consumer spending.

".... Weaker trade and manufacturing has contributed to the British Chambers of Commerce downgrade

"John Longworth, director general of the British Chambers of Commerce, said: 'Our persistently weak trade performance and current account balance are impacting our overall growth. Similarly, the manufacturing sector has been hit badly by falling global prospects, tipping an earlier prediction of growth in 2015 to an expected contraction.'

"So far it has been consumer spending and the services sector which have spearheaded a recovery in Britain which saw its economy outperform those of other advanced nations last year.

"......Longworth added: 'We cannot rely so heavily on consumer spending to fuel our economy, especially when driven by increased borrowing.

"He added: 'Investment in infrastructure is also crucial in enabling businesses to get their goods and services to market. The UK still needs to see a fundamental shift in its economic model if we are to remain relevant and prosperous in a changing world economy.'

"'Anyone who says that the job is nearly done needs to look again at the trade deficit, current account position and long-term business investment - and realise there's still a long way to go.' "

The Institute of Directors wants to stop companies paying taxes and have it loaded onto the poor as an extra purchase or value added tax.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2016/02/03/now-the-iod-wants-a-revolution-it-looks-like-class-warfare-to-me/

They say it will stop the tax deficit.
However, they will have to pay more to their workers, pensioners and in benefits. Otherwise they cannot afford to buy anything.
Like Eloethan says, this country has all but stopped manufacturing ( where are you, gillybob?) and relies on service industry.
We tend to have many micro-businesses, which do not get a mention along with the SMEs.

www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11428040/Britains-mid-sized-companies-overtake-the-Mittelstand-by-revenues.html

In an article in the Guardian in 2014 it was reported that in Germany there are "Mittelstand companies" which are specialised mid-sized companies which "power the nation's exports and GDP". They are predominantly family owned and manufacturing-focused (whereas the UK's economy is service-dominated and depends very much on domestic consumer spending). According to the article, the Mittelstand companies were formed by several years of planning, significant government support and a focus on investment in staff training of the highest quality.

I agree and with these big companies the founder who took the initial risks are long gone. Wonder why we don't have as many small/medium businesses as Germany? Less entrepreneurial spirit? People happy to just work for someone else? What happened to us?

I believe economists are generally in agreement that the UK economy is unbalanced in favour of large corporations, as compared with countries like Germany, which has far more small and medium sized manufacturing companies.

As you say Jane10 it would seem reasonable that the stress and financial risk involved in starting up a company and ensuring its continuation should be addressed through tax breaks. However, small and medium size businesses are not using all sorts of complex schemes. It is the huge corporations that have the resources which set them up, and small businesses have to compete on an unequal footing with these large, wealthy corporations.

Because, as some of you say, it is quite normal and to be expected that large corporations will abuse the tax rules in order to maximise profits, then I feel such tax breaks need to be stopped.

Investigations have shown that the top CEOs earn 300 times more than the average employee. That seems to me like a pretty good return for investment.

Businesses create employment. Employed people pay taxes. Its well worth encouraging people to set up and develop businesses otherwise we'd all be in the shit smelly stuff! Its got to be worth people's while otherwise why should they bother putting themselves through the stress and personal financial risk that it involves.

Nonnie is absolutely right.

Individuals may ( or may not) think that way, but a business is there to make money not give it away.

But if course they will Eloethan they are businesses not charities.

Nonnie If what you are saying is that there should no longer be tax incentives to encourage investment or to offset expenses against tax, I agree with you. If, as you say, the majority of individuals and businesses would be quite comfortable in using the tax system to hide their profits and inflate their debts/losses/expenses, then the only way to prevent it happening is to massively simplify the tax regulations to prevent these "loopholes".

Personally, I think it's a depressing thought that it is natural for people to believe it is acceptable to grab as much as they can even though it will be to the detriment of society as a whole.

Here in Scotland we're suffering huge cuts in all sorts of vital local services. This is because the SNP govt have locked the local councils into an agreement that they wont increase local rates. If a local authority refuses to sign up to this 'concordat' and goes ahead with increasing the rates by even a tiny amount they will have a large percentage of their central funding cut. Its really cruel to see how so many people are losing their jobs (2000 in our area alone) and vital services cut to the bone while the Scottish govt postures about! They try to blame Westminster but, just for once, its not them. Pah! Fed up!

No Eloethan that is not what I am 'suggesting' that, I am saying it is the alternative to getting companies to pay more tax than they are legally obliged to.

I cannot understand why so many people keep going on about these companies not paying more tax when I doubt that any individual would pay more tax than they are legally obliged to. What would the shareholders of these companies have to say if their profits were reduced because a company gave money away to the taxman? The answer is to change the system but this will take time and international agreement. If the UK unilaterally changes the system it will lose so many companies to other tax authorities which will not only reduce our tax take but also put a lot of people out of work.

We cannot blame one government for this, it has evolved over many years and will take as many years to change.

Obieone well put, also same with Eloethan comments I like her last para and question. Far too many people think we are being over political if we challenge any Government. That is how extreme dogma and unjustified policies are able to be implemented.

If the policies are unfair then they must be challenged, we need greater fairness and equity in our society. Policitician of any colour should stand down from office if they don't believe in fairer society in my view.

To most peoples' minds, Governments are thought to be the boss in the country.
In reality it is big business as their resources, especially collectively , are far in excess of the Government.
They are also collectively, far cleverer.

The view might be taken that the UK tax rules have deliberately been made extraordinarily complex and full of holes in order that they might be easily circumvented.

Or it might be thought that they are a genuine attempt to incentivise businesses and individuals to invest in areas that might require unusually high investment levels and/or which might seem risky and/or slow to yield profits. If true, it might seem a fairly laudable reason. However, whatever the motivation for these highly complicated tax rules/incentives, it seems to me that that most of these incentives should now be abolished.

Because of the complexity of the rules, it is not clear cut as to which schemes are genuine and which have been devised solely in order to avoid tax. It can take many years and huge amounts of resources for our tax authorities to take on the vast teams of legal and tax experts employed by large corporations. That is one of the reasons why HMRC negotiates with them rather than spending huge amounts of money and resources in trying to challenge them.

Nonnie Are you seriously saying that while there is an estimated annual loss of tax equalling £30 billion+ it is the responsibility of people on average incomes to pay more to make up the shortfall?

Nonie, I agree about paying more tax, but that includes the companies mentioned. Nigel Lawson had right idea when he said it should be paid on sales and UK could introduce such a change.

I like the views of Boris when he wrote in the Telegraph .

“It has never seemed fair that some of these companies – no matter how wonderful the service they provide – should be paying so much less in tax than the high-street tea rooms and bookshops they have pulverised. It would be a good thing, both for the UK finances and for the image of these great companies, if they paid more,” he wrote.

Good post nonnie

Sorry if I seem to be being contrary but this tax thing keeps coming up. These companies,are working within the rules, they have done nothing wrong and pay taxes in other countries too. The only way this can be changed is by international agreement which is being discussed but obviously will take a long time to make changes.

It is a complex problem which cannot simply be changed by the Chancellor in one country.

The way to provide more resources is simply for us all to pay more taxes.

Thanks Petra, RNIB rehab services are only one of the key services being hit by the cuts, which seem to be hitting far too hard the more vulnerable in society, whilst the likes of Amazon, Google, Apple, Starbucks shareholders and many more get so rich by avoiding paying a fair share of tax on sales.

Mr Osborne needs to rethink his taxation & budget stratergy.

Sorry to say that it wasn't that long ago that I was reading what a wealthy charity RNIB is. This was put down to the brilliant stuff that is going on in medicine.

Don't know how to spell "know", apologizes for the typo's in the above