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Where are all the tax revenues going?

(58 Posts)
Joelsnan Tue 12-Apr-16 11:21:29

I have to contest that technological innovation in health and education have resulted in higher cost services. These innovations have resulted in reduced manpower costs and in terms of healthcare shorter hospital inpatient stays.
As we all know central government payments to local governments have been slashed.
Borrowing was not undertaken to maintain social security, North Sea gas supported that during the dessimation of nationalised industries.
Are our expectations greater now to expect at least the same provision as we had before? to my mind we are paying more and getting less.

Nonnie Tue 12-Apr-16 10:53:52

Well said MOnica

Joelsnan it is quite difficult to compare now with post war as we all expect so much more now than then. For example, I was brought up without central heating and very few people went to university.

I agree that PFI was always a costly mistake and we are now seeing the results in Scotland. I do wonder however what was happening about building control in those schools, why didn't anyone watch what was being built?

Joelsnan Tue 12-Apr-16 10:13:43

Thank you Monica whilst I understand that pensions etc. comprise a large part of government spending and some privatised services are now being (extortionately) funded indirectly by the government. Actual manpower, pensions asset and infrastructure maintainence are now no longer a central government liability.
Post war, we were essentially a bankrupt nation however we still created a social and industrial infrastructure that provided work and welfare for the population with a better balance of payments, as a society, we built it, we owned it.
Our elderly were cared for, our roads were in better condition, our busses and trains did not just run on profitable routes. During this time we were not borrowing at the current out of control rate.
I recognise that our recent governments have turned us into a buy now pay later country through all of these PFI deals with ridiculous repayment terms, but still puzzle why I can see the country and its infrastructure descending in some instances to no better than a third world provision with a first world blinkered mentality.
We will never reduce the debt liability whilst the governments promote private investment funding of infrastructure meaning we never again own our infrastructure that has been sold off now resulting in infinite repayments and gross profit for investors.
Is this where our taxes are going?

whitewave Tue 12-Apr-16 09:22:34

There would be even more to worry about if everyone paid their fair share

absent Tue 12-Apr-16 09:17:51

M0nica This is why taxation rises and why governments in the past have borrowed money rather than cut social benefits. Every loan means interest costs, so government expenditure rises.

I wholly agree with the second part of your statement and would add that current government borrowing is at a record since records began in 1955. I partially agree with your first statement – I am thinking about VAT in particular – but income tax has reduced and so has corporation tax. When I started work in the 1970s, basic income tax was 33% but nowadays it is 20%.

rosesarered Tue 12-Apr-16 09:05:39

Good post Monica

M0nica Tue 12-Apr-16 09:03:44

The simple answer is in this link www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/budget_pie_ukgs.php and this shows that most of the money goes on Social Welfare, pensions and education.

However it is a mistake to think because something is privatised it doesn't mean that the government foots the bill. Schools will still be funded by the government, even if not run by them. Health services privatised will again be paid by the government. Many bus services receive government or local government support and local authorities get much of their money from government coffers.

While some privatised inndustries did run at a loss and cost the government money, many were profitiable and paid their profits to the government that lost this income source. If you look back 40 to 50 years you will see that social benefits are far more generous than they were then. Developments in medicine means that keeping the nation in reasonable health is far more expensive than it was 50 years ago. The school leaving age has risen, unemployment has risen. The technological costs of education and quality of buildings has risen. All this makes running this country much more expensive than it was. This is why taxation rises and why governments in the past have borrowed money rather than cut social benefits. Every loan means interest costs, so government expenditure rises.

Joelsnan Mon 11-Apr-16 20:33:26

I have just started wondering about this issue.
In the last 30 or so years our utilities have been privatised, our public industries have been privatised, our transport and communication systems are now privatised. Our education is being privatised as is our health service. Our councils are being stripped to the bone on government funding and yet our VAT rate has risen, we have a higher in work population paying tax. How come we are still paying so much tax to central government when we are not now paying for these services indirectly?
Am I missing something?