Hillsborough verdict

The Chief constable of South Yorkshire police has been suspended.
This is the same person that tipped off the BBC that Cliff Richards home was going to be raided.
Perhaps something is happening at last.

Yes I heard the verdicts, doesn't detract from the role of the police , the Chief Constable has been suspended , he was involved in the lies put forward at the second inquest ,

The football stadium and all involved should also face justice , many are angry with the police because of their lies , those lies put families through hell for twenty seven years

Lies and cover ups no, they're disgraceful and in no way acceptable, but bad, panicked decisions made in the heat of thlose terrible moments should perhaps be judged more in the light of the fact that none of us is infallible. We've all made mistakes at work, sometimes serious ones. I'm just so grateful that by the nature of my job, none of mine were ever going to cause real harm to another human being. The judgement also criticised the set up at the stadium, its safety certificate, inadequate turnstiles, a maximum capacity set way too high, all things that had been flagged up and known about before the disaster happened.

Sharing others' joy ab? Ha! Not something I would equate you with. Not in any sincere kind of way.

Perhaps mistakes were made , no one is infalable but are lies and cover ups a mistakes ?

If a doctor makes a mistake and someone dies is it just said oops sorry, a mistake

I would never support a witch hunt but I don't see a quest for justice as a witch hunt

A good post Maggiemb

It's important that we don't have witch hunts, especially in these days when far too many are tried by social media and people who just like to jump on any bandwagon (marching on paediatricians' houses, anyone?). There are vast numbers of honourable and decent cops out there, doing a very difficult and unenviable job. I heard an interview recently with a female police officer haunted ever since Hillsborough by the fact that she just couldn't save the victim she desperately tried to resuscitate. The verdict apportions blame to the ambulance service too (not quick enough to declare a disaster, so lives were lost). Which heads should roll there, or is it accepted that mistakes were made, but not maliciously?

Your choice Jingle, I think joining in with people's joy is good , you don't

I am delighted for the families, who have persevered for so many years, and now have justice. I am an ex Liverpudlian, and I am so proud of my City

I was not getting at the families. Just at people deliberately going along to "experience" the thing. If you read the post I made and summon up a bit of intelligence to understanding my meaning, you just *might^ get that.

I don't want to talk to you any longer ab. I find your attitude in so many things, unpleasant.

Does it matter who you addressed such unkind remarks to Jingle? Do you only post in reply to posts directed at you?

Ab I could have sworn I addressed that post to a particular poster, about a post, and it definitely wasn't you.

Who is making a living out of the deaths at Hillsborough Stansgran ?

14 people were charged with manslaughter and given prison sentences following the Hysel disaster.

The Hillsborough victims deaths were caused by people paid by the tax payer to protect life not take life

I don't think Heysel is brushed over . Not to my mind anyway. But I do think there are some in Liverpool who overdo the victim hood. I'm not talking about the families of the real victims but the almost industry of people making a living of it. Why has this gone on for two years? How can jury members be out of work for that long? The law has not helped in prolonging this.

Jingle, emotional hysteria? Do tell, if your child or grandchild had died then been accused of being drunk, stealing from the dead and injured you would have shrugged it off?

You have no idea what happens to families and communities when a disaster strikes, every home is grieving, then comes the suicides so more grief, divorce, alcoholism , filled up with prescription drugs , anger , fear , I assure you it is torture and stays for life

I believe that there must be Freemasons in both Houses of Parliament. I do know for certain of one, who is now a member of the House of Lords, and who, regrettably, must remain nameless.

I feel desperately sorry for the innocent victims in the Hillsborough disaster, but every time I see Liverpool supporters wringing their hands and shouting about blame, I wonder why no-one ever mentions Heysal? It was Liverpool supporters (thugs) who broke through fences there, attacking the opposing supporters and causing the deaths of 39 people and injuring 300 others. They were to blame then, but somehow this is all brushed over. And that was one of the reasons why fences were put up to prevent fans running onto the pitch, which if they hadn't been there .....

Also, I wish people would also remember that there was another football disaster in the 80s when 56 people were burned to death at Bradford City ...... and 28 policemen received bravery awards for entering that burning stand and helping people out - including one poor policeman who ran back onto the pitch with his hair on fire - I'll certainly never forget seeing that on TV as it happened.

I just thought we should cover our backs in case he does get prosecuted ;-(

I doubt very much he had any criminal intent. Maybe he was not someone up to the demands of the job. What was IMO is and was criminal was the lying. But if you are faced with causing the deaths of 94 people facing up to it must be a living ordeal. I speak as a Liverpudlian born and bred and with a DH the same and liverpool supporter

I am so happy for the people of Liverpool , at last they have the right verdict . I found it very emotional yesterday and still clearly remember all the terrible pictures in the papers of people suffocating and then the vile headlines which started pretty soon after .
Dukinfield should be prosecuted because he lied to protect himself at the cost of justice and vilified the people of Liverpool as a result .

I'm not going to defend him. I'm surprised the verdict came down quite so black and white though.

I did say "could" daphnedill and not "would" .

not like me to think before I type

He did call the shots though jings much the same as an employer asking his employees to perform a dangerous or illegal task. Or worse than that. He was someone in a public service who made a deliberate choice not to help the seriously injured and dying.

I wouldn't go that far without evidence, gillybob, but I do find it quite worrying that so many public officials are freemasons. I found out through family history research that my gt gt grandfather was one - he was also a local councillor and 'worthy'. Years ago, I spent quite a long time digging up newspaper cuttings, council records, some of his own personal diaries, business dealings, etc. There was loads and I'm not particularly proud of him. :-(

Freemasons do quite a bit for charity, but it's the secret networking and back covering which is a concern.

My father was another policeman who refused an invitation to join the masons. He loathed and despised them, something that didn't stop him being promoted up the ranks.

I too thought of the link between Hillsborough and the Miners strike. At my father's funeral, his former colleagues by then in their 80's agreed that the impact of the use and misuse of the police by Thatcher during the miner's strike would leave mistrust of the police, they said it would take over 40 years to diminish. They spoke with absolute horror of the met police waving wage slips at the miners.