Brexit watch

Ooo. Some direct hits there welshwife - mostly hitting the nail on the head. Powerful stuff!

There are so many things wrong in that CH article that it is not worth commenting on it.

So why did you?
Like Jane, I thought much of it was spot on.

Thanks for that translation WelshWife, and yes, this is exactly how the rest of Euroe sees us.

Smileless, the point is that we need the cooperation and collaboration of the rest of Europe, on border controls, on trade, both imports and exports, on financial services, on our energy and even water (which were all sold from Mrs T onwards to them), on the military and security + intelligence, terrorism, the environment, medical and scientific research, etc, etc, etc.

We have really alienated our neighbours, who see us as traitors and destroyers. Do you really believe a broken Great Britain, without Scotland and London, and perhaps ireland- will just go on rule the waves, as if nothing had happened?
We need to negociate asap with Europe- not easy to negotiate when you have alienated everybody in this way.

@JessM

It's not just for major refurbishment, but things like insurance policies, audit and legal fees, which they'd always taken for granted, because they were covered by LA schemes. Now they're having to negotiate deals at less generous fees than the LAs received. Moreoever they have to pay a finance officer and team to negotiate and administer it all.

Anybody who watched the Michael Dougan video will realise the enormity of the task ahead for the UK.

I think they had in English in the paper - I found hat article.

obie the truth sometimes hurts. However you see things that is how we are perceived.

I also think that the myth of a multi- cultural society where everyone is respected is also something that has been fed to the UK population over the years which has had the effect of the problems which are now so painfully obvious being not being dealt with, and nipped in the bud.

Well let's not go over the top here. That is Charlie Hebdo and a polemic. Undoubtedly some people will think like that, but the overall view here is much more nuanced in my opinion. I have seen quite a bit of sympathy in the French papers I have read and certainly from the people I have talked to. Bemused, astonished, sad, shocked, but a lot of understanding too. As one of my friends said, "We have people who don't understand what they are voting for, too".

whitwave We had a lot of kosovans and Albanians ( masquerading) as Kosovas come to this area in the 90s due to the Balkan war. Lots of 'bad' stuff was going on and people were angry because it was put out that you had to "understand what these people had gone through" that wasn't much consolation to the victims of the crimes being committed. When the authorities tried to ' nip things in the bud' it only made things worse.

The Charlie Hebdo article is rather disingenuous,but then again they are masters at courting controversy.
It is absurd to call a nation prejudiced,based on the views of a minority.

Trouble is thoughGranny2016 every interview with people both before and after the vote mainly claimed immigration as the main reason for voting leave. The rest of Europe could see these interviews knowing that some of their fellow countrymen were in the UK. What would you call it to see that? - I was sad to see that given as the reason - for decades Britain had been kind to people immigrating especially in times of trouble such as the Hugarian uprising etc. There are people too who think that this vote means those people settled in UK need to leave immediately - more bad information and a complete lack of understanding and feeling. And then of course there was Farage and that poster!

I agree with Mamie that many individual French people do not have that opinion of us especially when they have a totally different type of UK citizen that they know personally - even people we have never met have mentioned it to us and been sympathetic to what could become a real problem for us.

@Welshwife.

It is true that people interviewed were speaking against immigration.Some of those would be from areas where immigration is high,jobs and wages low ,so I do see their frustration,and the media are very good at manipulation.
I am white British,my friends are a mix of nationalities,it wouldn,t occur to any of us to think we were not equals.
Without doubt,we have some very prejudiced people,and sadly the vote gave them a voice.
The poster was utterly appalling.
They are a

Brexit: Angela Merkel's popularity grows in Germany after UK votes to leave EU
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/brexit-support-angela-merkel-in-germany-grows-after-uk-leaves-eu-denmark-a7129426.html

theconversation.com/brexit-shock-has-caused-a-sterling-crash-of-historic-proportions-heres-just-how-bad-it-is-for-the-pound-62191

Many people said that short term, it was likely there were going to be problems.
As one or two others have said, a divorce is like that.

The comments made on here about how we British are fascists and that is why we voted out are insulting and untrue, they say more about the vitriolic people that voice them. We didn't do what they thought we should do, so use any argument you can, play the race card that is a good one. It is beyond contempt and reassures me we have done the right thing, it seems they didn't like us anyway, so will be more than happy without us, we were obviously just tolerated at best. So we have to make this work, there will be no going back now.
Welshwife, that is how you see we are perceived. No how I and the people that voted out see it. I think you underestimate people, we the Britis are a tolerant and welcoming nation, we accept people for what they are and are welcoming. That is why people wanting live here. I can't see alive of people wanting to relocate. To vote out was about sovereignty and not to have our laws over ruled, a pity you could see it for what it was and is, it just had to be nasty. I will not put my two penny worth in, because it is pointless. Live on what might have been as long as you will.

Sorry about the not checking and altering grammatical mistakes. I felt so annoyed at my country constantly being attacked for what was a democratic decision.

I think you have just put your two penny worth in.

It's our country as well, not just yours. It still belongs to the 48%.

Nothing wrong in disagreeing with the outcome of the vote though, that is also democracy.

The 48% are going to say "we told you so" at every opportunity. And there are clearly plenty of those opportunities unfortunately.

Well said Mamie

Luckylegs as Mamie pointed out that article was a polemic.

Large parts of the article are untrue Luckylegs9. Not worth giving the time of day to.

1000 Barristers have written to PM advising that the vote to leave the EU it was based on misunderstanding and falsehood. The way the vote was conducted could therefore only be seen as ad isory particularly as it was a simple majority and not the standard usually set for such a momentous decision. It is therefore not within the MPs remit.

The worry that Brexit may cause a breakup of the union is being addressed by a group of Lords headed by Lord Salisbury.

So far the plan is to completely reverse the status quo, where power is held centrally and devolved. The suggestion now is to give complete sovereignty to all 4 countries. These sovereign countries would the cooperate in particular areas.
England would end up with 145 mps -blimey they would rattle around a bit in that building!