The New Cabinet

durhamjen. just pointing out double standards

Thats the trouble I cant remember where I read it. But I know there was a suggestion that property law may become an issue if ex - pats status changed.

All the stuff I can find about property law was just guesswork before Brexit.
Was there nothing on your course, whitewave?

Following me around, petra, being petty?

durhamjen. Your word magnanimity: part of the definition of: free from petty resentfulness or vindictiveness.
Not what you showed when commenting on the people stuck in the queue on their way to Dover.

What did I read about property law?

Yes I think that is so. There are reciprocal arrangements about health cover that will be more complex (no two countries having the same system) though.

I think that the question of EU nationals and expats must be one of the easiest agreements to negotiate.
I am also sure that such agreements could be made outside of Brexit. All it needs is goodwill on all sides.
Just hope it is there.

What I don't want is for the UK to guarantee that all EU citizens can definitely stay and then UK nationals promptly get ejected from all the other 27 countries. That is what Theresa May is saying she wants to avoid, in diplomatic language.
I don't think that scenario is likely, but the first duty of the British government is to protect British citizens.
Nobody likes it, it is worrying and unsettling for all of us.
I don't think there is any sense that it would be the last thing decided, I think the humanitarian view will prevail, but if things get nasty then anything could happen.
We are part of the negotiations whether we like it or not.

I know that, Mamie, but do you really want to be the last problem decided because you are such a useful tool in the negotiations?
It could be the first problem decided, but I doubt it would be as you are for bargaining with.

We are all in the same position DJ.

At least two years, possibly longer, for immigrants to be told that they do not have the right to live here any more, and they cannot disagree? Lots of them will go back home.

Not over rights to residence, but Sarkozy tried to remove our rights to heath cover and we were saved by the EU. We couldn't live here without health cover.
I don't think anyone has to be kind, just engage in sorting things out through diplomatic channels.

I have a brother who lives in Spain who had the choice of giving up his British nationality to get better tax deals. He did, as did his wife.
Denmark has just recently changed their laws on dual nationality, to accommodate the number of Danes who move abroad for work, then do not want to give up their birthright.
Like I said in an earlier post, it's whether you believe in multilateral or unilateral disarmament.
I believe that EU countries will do the right thing, so why not have the UK start it off, and give rights to EU citizens living here. There could always be a time limit; only to those who have lived here over 5 or 10 years.
Someone has to start being kind instead of suspicious all the time.
Do you have any reason to suppose the French or Spanish will treat expats badly?

But the problem is that thy might then decide not to display magnanimity in return. I really think she wants to give the assurance, but it is too risky.
The other issue with Spain is that you can't have dual nationality so although I have no doubt that our son will get it, he will have to give up his British nationality. Also my half-British grandchildren won't have an automatic right to live and work in the UK, nor yours in Spain (and Denmark?)
Swaps sound like a good idea!
It is all such a mess.....

By the way, my son's wife is Spanish. I can't imagine both countries will consider doing swaps, can you?

I know that, Mamie.
Real people are not bargaining chips wherever they live.
The thing is, it's the British people who have caused this impasse, and they should be the ones to start the process of allowing rights to all EU citizens who live here to retain those rights.
Nothing wrong with a bit of magnanimity. It might make other countries feel more generous to UK residents living there.

We are real people here in the EU too DJ.
My son has lived in Spain for over 20 years, Spanish wife, Spanish children (including my grandson with ASD).
No guarantees yet from the Spanish government, no possibility of dual nationality, huge problems for non EU citizens to obtain work permits in his field.
Whilst I have huge sympathy for EU citizens in the UK (and know just how they feel) I think Theresa May is absolutely correct to refuse to make cast-iron guarantees before the official negotiations over our status, rights to residence and health care have taken place.
It is already stressful enough, believe me.

It is unilateral if May announces it without EU leaders agreeing.She has every intention of allowing people to stay and rightly so,but there needs to be a concensus.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/27/theresa-may-eu-citizens-rights-britons-abroad

Not very helpful. Still using EU citizens as bargaining chips.
Time she realised they are real people with homes, jobs and families. It's a bit like multilateral disarmament but without the weapons.
I think she would get a lot more goodwill if she actually said they would be safe here.

Niggly you'd dared to mock her bestest mate.

He had a very Luke warm reception in America.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/26/british-eu-relations-to-be-resolved-by-2020-says-liam-fox

I find this strange. Fox saying that article 50 will be called on early next year, so everything is sorted by 2020 election, and being given credit for it.
I thought it was May's idea in the first place. It'll be scuppered if she calls an election.

What name did I call which person? I said 'LIKE a squawking hen!' I didn't say anyone WAS one!!

Grow up! Who wants to grow up. I've seen what happens to some people when they 'grow up,' they loose their sense of humour