vegan parents in Italy - grrr!

Some argue that the EU farming subsidies approach has encouraged the enlargement of farms and with that what people see as less animal-friendly farming practices—there are apparently 34,000 fewer farms in Britain than there were a decade ago.

It is estimated that 80% of payments under the Common Agricultural Policy go to 20% of farms, the largest ones.

I think Britain should use coming out of the EU as an opportunity to slow down damaging farming policies that are not good for the soil or for wildlife or species diversity. Good farming is also about clean water.

BTW, being vegetarian or vegan doesn't prevent the killing of animals; farming of any sort kills animals: ploughing kills trillions of animals every year. Small ones. Not so visible as a cow or a sheep but animals nonetheless. Most eating causes death when you think about it, and that is just a characteristic of life. There is no way of avoiding death in life: some life forms die whenever another life form eats. Eat or be eaten more or less sums it up. I am not arguing in favour of cruel practices. I support Compassion in World Farming.

I am surprised that anyone still finds it odd that someone prefers to be a vegetarian. It is no longer an unusual choice.

I don't think it is 'odd' to be vegetarian and I don't know anyone who thinks so either.
However, I do think people who subject their children to extreme vegan diets are misguided.

I find it odd that people think I'm 'odd' because I don't eat meat/fish. Lot's of people wait expectantly for some kind of explanation when they discover I'm a veggie. Why do I need to explain myself? What is so odd about not eating meat because I care about animals and the barbaric cruelty that goes on in farms and abattoirs? I find it odd that other people don't care and turn a blind eye to the suffering while they tuck into their sausages and bacon. www.peta.org.uk/

PS I don't agree with what the OP says the journalist is suggesting.

Sorry, I should have made clear that I'm simply pointing out that the evidence (foods people eat) shows that human beings are omnivorous 'by nature'.

Whether people want to be omnivorous is a separate issue,

Given that a very large proportion of human beings eat as if they were omnivores, then it follows, as the night the day, that human beings are omnivores.

Some human beings choose to limit what they eat to a smaller group of foods but they could, physiologically, be omnivores if they chose. A herbivorous animal could not survive on a carnivore's diet and a carnivore could not survive on a herbivore's diet because their digestive systems, having evolved along different paths, could not cope.

Human beings, like some other species, have a digestive system that copes with both meat and vegetation.

I decided to ask Google if humans have always eaten meat. The articles that came up ranged from yes to no, with maybe/sort of in there too. Some said we are natural vegans, others that we are naturally omnivorous. Some cited human teeth as evidence that meat eating is natural, others declared that human teeth are not designed for chewing meat, others that our teeth are not able to extract enough nutrition from plant sources alone. Not surprisingly, I'm confused. I looked at the origin of certain articles and it became a little clearer. The fors or againsts were often meat producer/eater or vegetarian/vegan rather than bona fide scientific. So I'm no further forward.

My children were brought up veggie
there is absolutely nothing wrong with a vegetarian diet for children, but it is extremely difficult indeed to feed a child, particularly a fussy one, enough of the protein, carbohydrates and fats they need to grow, and for the development of a healthy brain on a vegan diet. Some people may research it extremely carefully and may have children who eat what is put in front of them without a fuss but, reading about some of the cases granjura posted above, it is obvious that this is not always the case.

Breast milk is often lacking in vitamin D if the money has an insufficient amount in her body, particularly in winter.

I've been vegetarian for nigh on 35 years, and although not quite vegan (still buy free range eggs from neighbour) am almost dairyfree. I just can't bear the cruelty and suffering that goes on in the meat and dairy industry. And that is what it is now - an industry - not a farm like in the olden days. As sir Paul McCartney said 'if abbatoirs had glass walls, nobody would eat meat.
These days there are plenty of alternatives. People ask me where I get my protein from well er.....eggs, nuts, seeds, soya, pulses, non dairy milk substitutes. Plus everything we eat contains protein as proteins are the building blocks of all living things, you just have to combine them to get a balanced diet.
My children were brought up veggie but were allowed to eat what they wanted on days out or at friend's houses. They are very healthy adults. Don't get me wrong - I'm not a 'health freak' and love a bit of junk now and then like chips and cake etc but I just couldn't eat anything that is produced through cruelty - which meat inevitably is. The media always portrays us as being odd. I think it's odd to eat dead animals.

Jalima it is horrifying- those 'healthy granola' bars are another culprit. Absolutely full of sugar. DIL has a lot of sympathy for parents who have been misled, but none for those who keep giving their children cola and sweets in spite of warnings.

How do you know if somebody is a vegan?

Don't worry, they'll tell you.

trisher
DD's friend was horrified when the dentist told her that her children's teeth were bad - as they are not allowed lots of sweeties or sugary drinks.
The culprit is the 'healthy' packs of raisins (full of vitamins and minerals) she put in their lunch boxes - the dentist said that they are the worst thing for teeth as they stick.

My dentist DIL would probably have all the parents of the children whose teeth she has had to extract, because of the sugary drinks and food they have been fed since they were babies, locked up. She is always upset at the cases she sees.
Vegan children at least don't get the processed food some children do. These children are almost certainly less well nourished because of a lack of vitamins and essential minerals.

I have been a vegetarian for many years. Yet I was unhappy when my adult daughter became a Vegan and even more so when she announced she would be raining her two children as Vegans.
However, after nearly six years they are healthy children, correct wight and height. Their immune systems seem to be in very good order and they have only had antibiotics once.
Their diet is carefully researched. Once you get used to it alternatives are easy to find.

I became a Vegetarian when I was in my early thirties. My children were at that time about twelve, eleven and five.

I continued to cook meat for them and for my husband because I didn't think it was fair to impose my views on them.

My eldest son became a vegan when he was about 18 but it didn't last long. My other two sons were vegetarian for short periods of time but are now all meat eaters.

I don't eat meat or fish and some recent blood tests showed that everything was normal.

I certainly would never impose my views on anyone and now give my grandchildren meat and fish which they love.

Yes Granjura- I missed that but don't forget cows eat only greens and produce a lot of Calcium
Another sore point is the over use of soya. Its ruining the soil and it takes some manipulation to make a soya bean into milk which I assumme the breasfeeding mother was drinking.

We humans developed our brains by eating meat as the developing brain demands an awful lot of protein and why should that be removed from a child's diet just when its brain is still developing.
Be vegan if you want but give your children a boiled organic free range egg!

I too read about a case in Italy and felt physically disgusted. It is not a case of vegan principles, but misapplyingthe lack of knowledge in this instance to the point of child cruelty. For a child of 15 months (I think) to weigh little more than a babe in arms is truly shocking.
Of course education is better than prosecution, but could you look at your DGC with equanimity and imagine them wasting away because of their parents' "principles"?
If the parents do not have a child's best interests at heart, someone has to step in.
You may gave medical knowledge Margaret but the thought of a child subsisting on breast milk alone for 2 years sounds appalling. All the more so if the mother's own diet is restricted.

www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/07/11/italian-baby-fed-vegan-diet-hospitalized-for-malnutrition/

I'm vegetarian but never imposed it on my daughter (or her dad) and certainly not when she was a baby or growing child, she was welcome to try anything that family or friends were having. I agree with grandura that putting children on a guilt trip about food can do more harm than good. She decided for herself when she started going to nursery that she didn't like meat and now in her early 30s she's practically vegan. It's her choice, she's very healthy on it and so is her new baby who she's breastfeeding.
We've such an abundance and variety of food all year round these days that I think, like Downdale, this article is scaremongering and over-reacting. But in fairness, being vegan or veggie for ethical reasons like cruelty to animals doesn't necessarily lead to having a healthy balanced diet. There are plenty of salty, carbladen, sugary vegan or veggie foods to choose from, and I guess (hope!) this is what the politician means, when it becomes harmful.

Here is the case from AZ:

A Scottsdale woman who severely malnourished her three children was sentenced to 30 years in prison, the Maricopa County Attorney's Office announced Thursday.

Kimu Parker was convicted on three counts of child abuse and received 10 years for each count, Maricopa County Attorney Andrew Thomas said.

The sentences will be served consecutively.

"Thirty years in prison is entirely appropriate for a person who almost starved to death three defenseless children. We will strongly oppose any attempt to reduce this sentence," Thomas said in a press release.

When she was arrested, Parker's 3-year-old weighed 12 pounds, her 9-year-old child weighed 29 pounds and her 11-year-old child weighed 36 pounds.

The parents attributed the low weights to a strict vegan diet.

The youngest child was taken to the hospital in April 2005 after suffering many seizures over the course of several hours. Police reports show the parents didn't call 911 for several hours.

Read more: www.americanthinker.com/blog/2007/08/vegan_parents_starve_children.html#ixzz4H26Bv6EK
Follow us: @AmericanThinker on Twitter | AmericanThinker on Facebook

Careful with breastfeeding only for 2 years Margaret. If the mother is a strict vegan on very restrictive diet- the milk may lack in essential nutrients. Here is a comment re a case in Northern France of an 11 month old baby who died:

Breast milk is a near perfect food that is hands-down the best nourishment you can give to your baby. But it does have one downfall: its nutritional value is influenced by the mother's diet, and in extreme cases this can result in important nutrients missing from the breast milk.

In the tragic case reported above, it appears 11-month-old Louise lost her life because her mom's vegan diet created vitamin deficiencies in the breast milk she was exclusively fed on. Sadly, there were warning signs that the milk was not providing proper nutrition months before her death, as the baby was sickly and losing weight, but they were ignored.

'People following a strict vegan diet are often convinced that it is the healthiest way of eating possible, and this was most likely the case with Louise's parents. But this tragic case can serve as a powerful warning for those who choose to avoid all animal foods when breastfeeding.'

There are many other recorded cases of 'neglect' via strict vegan diets all over the world- a tragic one in Arizona where 3 children were found to be massively below normal weight and in very poor health. It is possible to bring young children up vegan- but it has to be done with extreme care, or else.

Not sure how I feel- agree that threatening parents with prison and social services is absolutely ridiculous- agree too that fast foods full of bad fats, sugar and preservatives is really bad for children (for all btw). And yet- I do worry about a strict vegan diet for young children, and also about the cohersion, pressure and possible exclusion from other children/'normal' life, in SOME cases.

I've seen it happen - and sadly food can be a massive manipulative tool in the wrong hands- and parents are indeed NOT always right about what is best for their children. The guilt put on some children who wish to eat eggs or cheese, or meat/fish - put upon by strict parents, can send children into dietary disorders, incl bulimia and anorexia, especially in teenage years.

If you intend to bring a child up vegan then you should breast feed for two years. That is the natural time for a human baby. They are then weaned and just need a whole lot of greens and pulses and bread and jam.

I have a related family who did just that and what they put on the table I find uneatable but they are healthy and 100% vegan.
These recipies piled high with salads and smoothies is not necessary to live as a vegan.

I wouldn't do it as I like meat and eggs and just don't believe that that big chocolate cake was as good as a piece of Sacher Torte bought in Vienna.

I presume that the article contained a grain of truth but knowing the italians nothing will come of it.

Actually grandson's non-vegan dad is Italian born, although UK educated, and the family in the UK and Italy always catered for the vegans very well when there were visits. Many are in the UK now and grandson is spending this week of his holidays with the cousins he has lots of fun with, and I know aunty and grandma will organise food so that he has healthy and delicious meals. Italian dad is a wonderful cook, Adding eggs now grandson is no longer vegan has helped expand what he can have . Never seemed a problem in Italy.

But grandson and his dad did a camp with Woodcraft in Germany a couple of weeks ago and he reported that the food there was awful. He said the veggie sausages were sliced of bread rolled up and fried with gravy on top! And the rest was not good either. Luckily there was a camp shop to buy rubbish at to fill up on.

#1 daughter is vegan and grandson is 10 now and was vegan until he was nearly 9, when he decided vegetarian instead, His dad was not veggie and although meat is around they always do veg stuff for him. Mum researched carefully and knows how to include everything a growing child needs.

Grandson has a 16 month old baby sister who is bouncing and dimpled and doing fine on the delicious vegan food her mum makes. The children get no rubbish as it was not vegan . Cakes and puds for occasions are wonderful. I think the sticky chocolate cake is easily as good as the Sachertorte I make.