Government must have vote on Brexit

Petra which part of my post do you think is untrue?

Ana

Yes I saw that on Sky News.

I found it an odd position to adopt but then again we are in an odd time.

POGS, apparently Tom Watson has been putting it about that no one will have to resign 'permanently' if they defy the whip, and Corbyn hasn't contradicted him.

Such integrity...

Varian Your truth, not everyone's, and certainly not the majority who voted to leave.

Thread Heading

Government must have a vote on Brexit.

Corbyn said this today after confirming the Labour position is to vote for triggering Article 50 :-

"Parliament has to respect the result of the Referendum.

We should not say we know better than the result of the Referendum.". (Amen to that)

On his Shadow Cabinet resignation's:-

"No need for anyone to have resigned at this stage"

Followed by

"Obviously it would be impossible to stay in the Shadow Cabinet if you actually vote against a decision made after a very frank and long discussion of the Shadow Cabinet earlier this week "

First time I agree with the Labour Leader. Will it be a different story come next week?


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Malta is and always has been a friend of Britain. We should listen to our friends,

The Leave campaign kept telling us that the rest of the EU sold more to us than we sold to them and French farmers would still want to sell us their cheese and German car manufacturers would want to sell us their cars so we could call the shots, dictate our own terms, have our cake and eat it.

Sorry , no. We sell 44% of our exports to the rest of the EU. They only sell 5% of theirs to us. The interests of the French farmers and German car manufacturers will never outweigh that crucial statistic.

It is pie in the sky to think we can call the shots trying to negotiate from such a position of weakness. We can naver hope to get such a good deal as we have now as a member of the workd's largest and most successful trading bloc. It may not suit the billionaire tax exiles who own the right wing press to explain that, but it is the truth.

Since the vote in UK the other states have tended to get more united rather than wanting to leave - they can see the sort of problems the UK is now having trying to sort things out.

Have you any evidence for that opinion, Welshwife?

The prime minister of Malta said whatever deal we get will be inferior to the deal we have now with the eu.
He also said " Europe is facing oblivian and may not survive a fresh migrant influx this spring unless it takes radical action to crack down on stratospheric levels of economic migration * immediately*
He warned that " if this doesn't change eurosceptics will take over the block in a few years"

The U.K. has benefitted by money for roads too - the Heads of the Valleys Road being one of the latest. The more rural parts of Wales has benefitted immensely from funding to assist students living in areas which made it very difficult to get to FE colleges - they paid for good video links so these students could go to their local college and watch the lectures at colleges too far away.

The farmers receive great grants too - of course they now realise that the UK Govt my well not pay these grants and they will need to find some other way to make their farms so efficient they make a living. This will be very difficult on some of the farms with almost hostile terrain.

Most countries have benefitted from EU membership in some way or another. Since the vote in UK the other states have tended to get more united rather than wanting to leave - they can see the sort of problems the UK is now having trying to sort things out.

Varian Of course the PM if Malta would say that. If the other country's that are in the brink of exiting got wind of a reasonable deal for UK, they would be out of the traps like greyhounds.
The EU will lose a lot of income from the UK both in remittances and generated trade they will have to maintain their over cumbersome and overpaid administration with around 20% less income, as a result some things in the EU will have to suffer so of course they are miffed.
Malta has benefitted from EU membership, they have nice roads now, however their importance to the EU is more to do with their strategic military position than any industrial, manufacturing or financial expertise which other countries have to rely on.

Have you signed it yet, Ana?

Ginny put it on. She started the thread, so should know what she wanted it to be about.

That sounds a bit close to home, Margaret. The rich in this country could take us out of austerity and save the NHS if they wanted to. Instead, they want the UK to be a tax haven.

Why is stuff about the Trump petition even on the Brexit thread?

Roses please dont go on again about Greece when the rich Greeks could have saved Greece from all its financial trouble if they had been inclined. Germany has paid millions trying to help, they hoped to get a tax system going where each house is known to have an address and each house owner pays a few taxes for water etc. It failed. the Greeks couldn't get it going. They dIdnt want to, everybody has his mother in law and brother in law, nephews and nieces in the adminstrative office with them. The wage bill was enough to make any country bankrupt.

Joelsnan if everybody in the EU is rolling in money why on earth does the UK want to leave?

The EU is worth investing in and plenty invest in it , it is well organsied and productive. If the Uk could -just for once - organise themselves in manufacturing like they do for Royal occasions and the Olympics then it would really be a success story.
The fact is that these organisers dont need to work but are part of the feudal aristocratic system which holds all the purse strings and all the weight of decision making and makes those decisions to better themselves.

500,000+ It might make the million today.

Ana if you had visited or known Greece in the 60s before the EU you would have seen a country that was very poor. Yes it has it's problems now, and possibly some of the improvements would have happened through the holiday industry. But I doubt if even that could have paid for the huge improvements to transport and the infrastructure. It's easy to look at the short term difficulties and to think there have been no longer term improvements.

445000+ signatures now, Ginny.

Being in the EU has been terrible for Greece!

Joelsnan all you can expect is scornful derision on here if you don't go along with either left wing (Socialism )or wanting to Remain in the EU.There is no debating, I realised that ages ago, all is point scoring and endless links to questionable blogs.
Yes, thank God we are leaving the EU at this time, and have time to make our own deals before the EU bubble bursts.It would have been a disaster to Remain in it.

I have just read it DJ and pretty scary reading it is. Thanks for posting the link. Who will monitor the nuclear stations in the UK? What about other people's nuclear waste we're accepting in our ports and transporting on the railways?

Further essential reading in Politico, '5 takeaways from the May-Trump talks.'

If you haven't seen it, a petition to prevent Trump's visit to the UK has already reached more than 300,000 signatures which is another issue the Government will have to debate by UK Law.

So joining the EU has been good for Greece, has it?

I remember Greece in the 1970s. Trisher is, I suspect, being perfectly serious.

As we have been told by the Prime Minister of Malta that whatever deal the UK can have on leaving the EU must be inferior to what we have now.

Theresa May says if we don't get a good enough deal we will leave anyway on WTO terms (ie even worse deal)

At the end of the negotiations we must be offered the choice of accepting the negotiated deal or forgetting the whole thing and remaining in the EU, not just a choice between a bad deal and an even worse deal.

It is not just the 48% who should ask for this but also the leave voters who never wanted us to leave the free trade agreements or customs union, the folk who now realise that they should not have believed the lies spun by the leave campaign and those who did not sign up for their children and grandchildren to be so much poorer because the country made a catastrophic mistake.