Labour now

I agree, but like Keir Starmer, they are still new.
I suppose if there was a snap election, they would have longer to show what they are made of before the one after that.
I like Rebecca Long-Bailey, and Chi Onwura.
Debbie Abrahams is good, too. She actually resigned from a PCT because of the use of private healthcare - a proper socialist.
All from up north, too, the women.

Jen re Tue 14-Mar-17 20:47:51 some of the younger women are really making their mark too. There are a couple who very impressive in interviews too.

I am not sure that Labour doesn't matter Jen, but everything is shifting and working out where and how they fit seems interesting. The very fact that EM is tweeting successfully tells me that someone like Corbyn leading the party allows for others to move back to being themselves. We seemed to go through a period where everyone was trying to be a copy - probably of Blair. In many ways Blair made a good Blair but I have no idea why people think every leader should be cut from the same mould.

dd thank you for the site names. I do like facts

Pathetic, Ankers. Tory voters did not vote for Miliband's ideas. Or did you?

If May is stealing Miliband's ideas and they are good one, then good.
She could steal ideas off a child for all I care, so long as they are good.

The msjority in the country do not watch parliment. Are you claiming Kinnock and Umanna appear in full tv interviews, I am not speaking of a quickie few questions on the green.

Keir Starmer led the Labour side in parliament yesterday, Annie. I am surprised you did not see him, or Chris Leslie, who often has a lot to say.
Chukka Umunna and Stephen Kinnock are often on the news, too.
Do you only notice those you dislike?

This is interesting. If Labour do not matter any more, does it matter who adopts Labour ideas?

www.indy100.com/article/ed-miliband-energy-companies-pricing-theresa-may-government-labour-conservative-brexit-latest-7625421

May stealing Miliband's ideas.

Daphne, without googling do post which party has won five elections on the run

Because of Momentum members and the unions nightowl ,

Where is this strong leader Annie and why doesn't s/he come forward?

Daphne, speaking of the train stunt is not bitchy it is a fact ,he lied.

You are mistaken, it matters very much who is leader now , a strong leader gets his policies to the voters, a strong leader is respected by his/her party, other parties and the voter. How can labour get any message across when only McDonald, Abbot,Thornberry and some times Corbyn speaks .

I csnnot ask,I do not tell people, to vote labour when the foursome do all the talking, we hear so little from the rest one would think there was only four lsbour MP's

Voters do vote on policies but they also vote on leadership, do try canvassing, you will learn more than googling experts,

Gg There are a number of researchers on sites such as 'Britain Elects' and 'Electoral Calculus' which collate actual results, polls and in-depth interviews. There's a major book out next month.

I agree with you that the Labour Party doesn't seem to fit in. The various groups who have traditionally voted Labour are distancing themselves from each other and don't do compromise very well.

annie Labour lost two elections before Corbyn even became leader. I expect you will remember as well as I do that there were many people in 2015 who complained that Labour had drifted too far to the right.

Reading umpteen times that Corbyn was involved in a train floor PR stunt which went wrong (and umpteen other bitchy comments which have nothing to do with policy) have certainly contributed to putting me off voting Labour.

It really doesn't matter who is leader now. Labour doesn't have a distinctive and coherent message. Brexit has split it, while there are those who think it's still about class. The party spends most of its time arguing about organisation and definitions and sniping at each other (about Corbyn's hat and trains). Meanwhile, the biggest open goal for decades doesn't have any forwards.

Rather than constantly criticising Corbyn, try telling people why they should vote Labour (assuming a new leader can be found).

dd I was sort of aware of what you put in your post but it's interesting to see it all laid out like that. It is annoying to see that the Conservative marking of themselves as competent with the economy works when they simply haven't been and I wonder if it is just that or that they like the attacks on certain groups. It's sad but where does the LP fit in?

I wonder if not being able to post without making a nasty remark about Corbyn is some kind of syndrome?

Right, I am thinking who was elected in 2010, but I can only recall Chuka Umunna and Tristum Hunt. Hunt has gone and Chuka declined at the leadership election .

Hell, I got it wrong, I thought it represented Corbyn, going this way, that way, any way depending on his mood.

Nightowls posted pic was very funny as it perfectly showed the lack of interest ( no big crowds) in the demo for supporting EU workers planned by Momentum.I see it was actually put there as a jibe about this thread ( charming) but it didn't work that way because we all laughed.

Perhaps Daphne,but i do think it is the weak leadership which is causing so many to leave. Labour will lose seats with the boundery chsnges, most are labour seats, the party has to reach out to middle England .

GracesGran

It's not if people stop voting Labour - they are already stopping.

Research, polliong and actual results suggest that they're going off in all directions:

1 Some are going to Ukip. Although Ukip is falling apart, Arron Banks, who claims he's been suspended by Ukip, is on the verge of starting a new party. He claims this new party will be more 'professional' and use modern marketing techniques (like Trump). We'll see!

2 Some (particularly younger Remain supporters) are going to the LibDems or the Greens.

3 Some are going to the Conservatives. When interviewed, they see the Conservatives as more competent on the economy and some seem to have been swayed by May's JAMs rhetoric.

It's difficult to see where Labour should position itself. It's bound to lose voters in the short term, whatever it does and whoever is in charge.

I wasn't trying to twist anything POGS, I was supporting what you said, i.e.,

Perhaps if I abide by that saying I would be entitled to use the word 'hate/hated ' when talking about Left Wing voters who seem to find it fair game to use the word against anybody who votes Conservative.

It may have read better if I had written "If the left-wing voters were to annoy you it would surely be ..." I am sorry I didn't check it and make it all conditional but I do think the meaning was pretty clear.

GG MK2

" If the left-wing voters annoy you surely it is some aspect of their way of thinking that you might hate, not them as people. "

Why did you include that? I don't hate left wing voters whether it be in reality , hypothesized or by somebody twisting my words.

Have many people said they hate or hated the Conservative voters POGS? I can't say I have noticed it but 'hate' does seem an extreme word I agree. You could 'hate' the outcome of policies I suppose or 'hate' people's misogyny or whatever it is that annoys you but, especially if you don't know the person I can't see how you could hate them. If the left-wing voters annoy you surely it is some aspect of their way of thinking that you might hate, not them as people. That would apply especially on here as we only see one or two aspects of someone and then only through the written word.

I would agree with your final sentence; you are better staying away from 'hate' really.