Labour now

[not quite sure how often I am going to need to write the above on gransnet, before it actually starts to sink in with some. About 1 1/2 years should do it? ]

I am actually going off "party" politics. Give some independent candidates a chance is what I think.

We bang on and on and on and on and on about the labour party, the conservative party, UKIP, even liberals.

But fail to see that other independent candidates are trying to become MPS. Why not read their manifestos a bit closer, and some might just surprise us.

dj, I dont support a party!!!!!
I vote all over the place.

Teresa May? I havent made up my mind about her. I dont feel I know her at all.

dj. The thread is about labour now.
So would you like an answer about that? Get rid of Corbyn. But that is hardly an original answer!

4th industrial revolution? Not convinced one is coming, so no answer for that either, as dont even think it may happen really.
So if there is no question, there is no need for an answer.

You call that an answer, do you, Ankers?
I call it pathetic.
No wonder Gracesgran thinks Labour has the answers. The party you support obviously has none.

www.transparency.org.uk/publications/faulty-towers-understanding-the-impact-of-overseas-corruption-on-the-london-property-market/

MawBroon, but I can answer too! Look! I am doing it now! Wow!

The people on the street are the voters

and the press have always hammered labour

www.transparency.org.uk/publications/corruption-on-your-doorstep/

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/mar/05/rich-pay-up-to-keep-property-ownership-secret

Tax from the rich? It's just a start. As far as the Tories dare go without scaring off their Russian and Middle Eastern friends.
It's a way of rich people avoiding tax, and pretending they do not own these houses. For the most part they do not live in them.

The Tories have borrowed far more over the years than Labour ever have. They just use it in different ways, lend it to their banker friends, not to help build the infrastructure, affordable houses, etc.
The Tories do not get criticised for their borrowing because the media is on their side.

What's your answer, Ankers?
I haven't noticed you having one.

And LibDems are doing what, daphne?

You know very well that Labour can't win with the media, or with the people on the street.
If they go into their communities they are pilloried for not being seen on television.
Who was on the march yesterday? Were there any Tories? Was Sarah Wollaston there? She should have been as she is the voice of Tory opposition to the cuts.

Ankers I really think DJ is capable of answering for herself (?)

dj is very happy to borrow more and more.
That has been her answer for ages.

durhamjen

In order for 'The Big State' you require massive government spending. If as is being spoken of we are on the verge of the 4th Industrial Revolution how do you raise the finances without borrowing more , more and more. There will still be winners and losers but probably on an even wider scale, those at the top will have total control over swathes of unemployed benefit receivers.

Now you can say by taxing the wealthy and closing in on tax loop holes but that will never be the answer because individuals , companies, organizations may not be based here, abide here . Taxation for the sake of hammering the rich because of class warfare is not realistic if it brings in less tax!

I mention tax as it is a mantra for Labour to repeat 'We will stop the tax giveaways to the rich, we will crack down on tax loopholes". Fine, if it brings in more revenue but if it doesn't then where is the financial acumen?

Yes, it probably is bias, although Labour's losing Copeland is historically more important than retaining Stoke. So don't buy it again.

McDonnell needs to stop moaning about something he can do nothing about. I follow quite a few MPs on Twitter and it's quite interesting which ones are using newer forms of media and how they're using it. If they can't rely on the media, they need to get out into their communities and show that they're making a difference.

I found it interesting in the focus group recordings that the people interviewed knew virtually nothing about politics, although they had strong views. I doubt very much that they read any further than headlines. Labour needs to realise that many people aren't interested in facts. They're only interested in soundbites which confirm their views, Ukip realised that years ago. Nobody can make people look for any more.

People aren't moved by sob stories either, because people who are struggling blame those who aren't coping at all as responsible for their own situation. The people further up the chain couldn't care about any of them, but manipulate the prejudices of the ones just above the poverty line.

You can't stop people getting their news from wherever they want. You need to attack it without patronising people.

In order to prepare for the fourth industrial revolution, you need a big state to pay everybody, using basic income.
The Tory government is founded on a small state and privatisation.
You cannot have everybody out of work apart from those that are working in new technology industries.
Labour are interested in using PQE to invest in infrastructure, build more houses for people to live in, improve the roads and railways.

GG MK2

" As far as I can see, and I am not a Labour supporter, the only party who are looking to the changes the future will bring is the Labour Party. "

You say you are a non Labour Supporter you obviously do not think the political party you would vote for will 'change anything looking toward the future' . Fair enough a blind faith in the party we vote for is a folly none of them are perfect.

Can I respectfully ask though , what you think Labour will do to with regard to the likes of 'Uber', 'Alibaba' 'Face Book/Apple' etc.?

What do you see and hear from Labour that gives you confidence Labour can handle the increase of robotics in manufacturing?

When you say, "There will be no renaissance of manufacturing in the West. The notion that the West is going to rebuild all those factories is tremendously dishonest.", how do you think Labour can turn the tide?

I believe , please correct me if I am wrong, your post could be aligning itself to what is commonly known as the " 4th Industrial Revolution". (41R). I have used the words from Wikipedia to give a brief description of 41R).

"The Fourth Industrial Revolution, or 4IR, is the fourth major industrial era since the initial Industrial Revolution of the 18th century. The Fourth Industrial Revolution can be described as a range of new technologies that are fusing the physical, digital and biological worlds, and impacting all disciplines, economies and industries.[1]

Central to this revolution are emerging technology breakthroughs in fields such as artificial intelligence, robotics, the Internet of Things, autonomous vehicles, 3D printing and nanotechnology.[2]"

I am not saying you are right or wrong in your belief but I am interested as to why/how you believe, especially as you declare you are ' not a Labour Supporter ' only Labour are looking to the changes the future will bring and what sort of things have Labour said or done that gives you such confidence only Labour can handle what I believe to be major problems for us all.

Talking about media influence and bias, I buy The Week Junior for my grandson and his sister to read.
This week's copy had a full page about Labour losing Copeland, and about the lack of faith in Corbyn.
Not a single mention of the Stoke by-election.
Whatever you think of Corbyn, you cannot deny that is bias.

The Week Junior is up for an award, in the same class as the i.
Schools subscribe to it. It's for kids 9-14 years old.

Seeing the Labour party consulting and reviewing policies for the future makes me feel they are seeking to address the problem. If it doesn't make you feel like that dd that's fine.

I agree that they should have said the German Mittalstad companies but I didn't write it so cannot correct a quote.

How is the Labour Party seeking to address the problem? Sorry, but I don't see it.

Not only that, but AFAIK there is no German company called Mittalstad. It's a concept used to describe small to medium towns, which are the homes to many of Germany's small companies, which concentrate on quality engineering and have been phenomenally successful.

This might be part of the problem :

1. The world’s largest taxi company (Uber) owns no taxis
2. The world’s largest accommodation provider (Airbnb) owns no real estate
3. The largest communications companies (Skype, WhatsApp, Facebook Messenger, Viber) own no infrastructure
4. The world’s most valuable retailer (Alibaba) has no inventory
5. The most popular media platform (Facebook) creates no content
6. The fastest-growing banks actually have no money
7. The world’s largest movie house (Netflix) owns no cinemas
8. The largest software vendors don’t write the apps (Apple, Google, Facebook)

There will be no renaissance of manufacturing in the West. The notion that the West is going to rebuild all those factories is tremendously dishonest.

Manufacturing works in a very simple way, capital substitutes for Labour at the margin - and the more capital you have the less labour you need. Look at German company Mittalstad : output is going up whereas employment is going down.

We live in a world where literally 10% of the global population could produce complete abundance for the rest. This means that we have an institutional problem & a political problem dealing with that fact, but the global economy doesn't have a problem about where we are going to make stuff in factories.

As far as I can see, and I am not a Labour supporter, the only party who are looking to the changes the future will bring is the Labour Party. Weakened by attacks from within they are still addressing, quietly at the moment, the prospects for the future the above quote describes while the Tories continue to blame one group or another rather than find solutions. The future could be good for all but you have to see the truth to make it so.

The part in italics is quoted from a Nye Bevan News Facebook post.

Did you know that May has been forced to make five u-turns already because of Corbyn's leadership?
You will not find that in any MSM, will you?

Er - voters are not influenced by the media, are they?