Are the UK electorate out of touch with reality?

Everything in and about politics is biased. Just think about that for a moment. Nobody is going to tell us the other side are doing better. The media has always been split to left or right.

Voting means each one of us has to weigh up all the available info and make a choice. None of the political parties or politicians are wholly right; none of them always do as promised, omly in part. Generalities do exist such as labour cannot manage the economy while the tories can; but even then ity is possible to find some exceptions.

Politics is a minefield we have to negotiate.

I think sometimes it's instinct, some politicians are just not nice they come over as caring they come out with comments that are annoying, so to say the newspaper is biased is true but the politicians are liars as well.
I can't forget what Clegg prmised to the students if they voted for him. And what happened when his party chose to go in with the conservatives he didn't help the students. When pierce Morgan interviewed him about the situation he said that's politics.
It's finding someone you can trust, and frankly I can't trust any of them.
Labour and the conservatives have been in power mostly, they have never done anything to solve knifecrime. I am a mother that is what I want to see change.

Nationalisation wouldn't cost the country anything! That's a myth and it's sad to see that political journalists are so financially illiterate.

The government would issue long term bonds to investors. The interest on the bonds would be paid from profits.

Last time I looked, government bonds are paying just over 1% interest. CPI is currently 2.7%,so it makes absolute sense to renationalise now. There are asset holders, who are looking for opportunities to invest their money safely and would snap up government-backed bonds.

Professor Jonathan Portes (now at King's College London, but formerly a civil servant/economist working for HMRC and the DWP) thinks that renationalising water is a daft idea, but renationalising other utilities is absolutely the right thing to do - as do other senior economists.

If you Google Portes, he explains better than I have why renationalisation costs nothing and certainly doesn't impact on the deficit.

Excellent comments ladies
James you need to rethink your posts. They r condescending. Please treat us grans with more respect!

Communism is a great leveller, but it's always levelled down for the majority (and the rich will manage to evade the levelling as usual).

But we're not talking about communism here. We're talking about a left of centre proposal.

Richard Murphy comments here:

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2017/05/17/labours-doing-the-country-a-service/

Note:^First, this shows how far to the right politics has moved.^

He's commenting on this:

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/may/16/the-guardian-view-on-the-labour-election-manifesto-widening-the-bounds-of-the-thinkable

Apologies to the Jaggernaut Lady who believes I am being a tad patronising, for my expression of appreciation and being honest and polite in respecting of other peoples views. Perhaps, politeness belongs to the era I grew up, Though it might help more if I knew the exact true meaning of the word " Tad ".

Re the question of what I mean by reality is sound, because it can be vague. In this content I was using it as the "true situation that exists, rather than the conflicting interpretations presented by the media and propagandists ".

Hope that helps the excellent debate, thanks also Juggernaut for giving this mere male a much better understanding and a good example of an uncalled for rather "bitchy" remark. Are they intended to help to encourage people to use these columns?
Touché

Great comment Cindersdad. There is no money under the present format. If we tax the high earners, the really rich will make sure their money is safely out of the way, so the taxes will be paid by people who earn more than the level they will have to bring it down to in order to raise the sums promised (that could mean any people who do not currently earn more than £30,000 pa)and the companies who are suddenly faced with extra large tax bills will be more inclined to move to EU countries. I don't know which way to vote. TM is forceful and looks like she could do the job, but has so far not given any real indication that she can improve things. JC thinks the answer is to borrow even more money that we cannot afford to repay and tax those I mentioned above with the likely outcomes mentioned. Communism is a great leveller, but it's always levelled down for the majority (and the rich will manage to evade the levelling as usual).

I agree about the railway mostly but the other utilities would cost an absolute fortune as the government would have to buy them out.Where is that money coming from?
McClusky knows that Labour won't win, but wants to keep Corbyn in place afterwards.

It wasn't aimed at anyone on the forum Maizie but the country in general.
You can lament the lack of interest in
Politics but can hardly lament the fact that not everybody is intelligent, it's just a fact of life, like not being attractive, or able to play the piano etc.

Looking at the newspaper headlines reactions to yesterday's Labour Manifesto, I was horrified to see the anti-Labour bias. The Daily Mail's "Corbyn plan to bankrupt the U.K." was predictable but even The Guardian led with union leader McClusky's prediction that there will be a Tory landslide. The BBC's reaction was all about high tax too. Higher tax would only affect people earning over £80,000.
I thought it was a good Manifesto even if it couldn't all be achieved in one five year term. It wouldn't cost anything to start renationalising the railways as franchises come up for renewal. Might even make a profit for the country rather than for the fat cats.

Have posters only just realised that: not every voter is intelligent/not every voter is interested in politics/

Be careful, roses; some people don't like the implication that they're not intelligent..

Of course posters realise that it might be so. But it's something to lament rather than condemn

I heard the interview mentioned above and was equally shocked at the responses of those interviewed. However, on reflection, I am not entirely sure that I would have fared much better. I feel that the days of clearly-attributable policies are gone. Nigel Farage was on Radio 4's 'Any Questions' recently, and responding to comments from the other panellists about UKIP being an irrelevance these days, he read out a list of policies, which he claimed as UKIP's from 5 years ago, and which have now been trotted out by the Conservative Party.

...and would that be like the French Revolution or the Russian one?

Have posters only just realised that: not every voter is intelligent/not every voter is interested in politics/ different newspapers have different political bias/ you can't believe every comment or even photo you see.
and that has always been the case!
You have to make your own mind up and forget anybody else.At least with a democracy if things become really bad the government can be kicked out next time around.

"Vive la Revolution!" eh, radicalnan?

The 'Today' Programme on Radio Four had a breakfast interview with a group of ex Labour voters who were undecided about their vote this time round. They hadn't a clue about anything. They thought May's utility price ceiling was a Labour measure and hadn't heard the phrase 'strong and stable' at all. The interviewer gave up trying to get any sense out of them and just started to ask them wind-up, taking-the-mickey questions.

Of course, as a teacher, I was shocked but not at all surprised at how low the level of sentience fell.

And we all have a vote!

I believe that the two party politics thing is dead in the water the world over really, parties are just so close that no one is ever in power really. The ping pong effect gets us nowhere.

I am bitterly disappointed when I watch debates that politicians are so thick, how dare they be thick, they want to represent us, me and they are stupid.

We as a population need to be instigating new parties and new ideas urgently but are stuck withthe old time 'religions' of the political parties.

Brexit it hugely important this time round, I voted fir it and we may as well get the best possible deal, what is wrng with that?

I am also dismayed watching young people on TV being so absolutely lazy, one said 'there should be a phone app to tell us all this' .........FFS grown up everybody and either take a real interest or leave well alone, expectng the phone to give you an insight is puerile. The media does not have all the answers, experience counts for much more.

I think all the parties stink and we need different choices, not them rinkering with the deckchairs while the ship sinks.

I followed the BREXIT debate closely and it dawned on me how brainwashed the British public have been over the years, mostly by the papers but also from the BBC which I am so shocked about. The way they fixed audiences and debates to sway people to their point of view really horrified me. I feel as though I have had my eyes opened at last. I have cancelled all papers and now watch other world news programmes. I refuse to be brain-washed anymore! It is not just the BREXIT experience, it is everything. We are being brain-washed by each Government but especially by the BBC and I refuse to play the game any longer. Very upsetting I think. I trusted the BBC and believed their every word, but NO LONGER! The BBC is no more than a propaganda channel for the Government. They tried and tried to convince people not to vote to leave the EU and at the end of the day they did not put this country first, they were just thinking about themselves and their friends and how they could make them richer than they already are at the expense of the poor workers. I am so angry about this as I am sure others are too.

As an ex teacher I completely agree Varian

Well said daphnedill - completely agree. Voters bombarded with positive stories about TM from biased newspapers and BBC tv and radio. It scares me how divisive and right wing we have become since the Brexit vote. It seems to have given the green light for all the closet racists to come out. With a collapsing NHS and education system I fear for the future of my grandkids under the Tories.

I base my vote on how I see my Councillors working locally. The Labour team have 3 locally, I see the work they do,they regularly attend community meetings and are easily contactable that's enough for me. Our local MP defected to the Conservatives but was still our Councillor for several months; never saw sight nor sound of him unless there was a photo opportunity...... speaks volumes as do their policies.

I have been a member of gransnet for a while and enjoy the posts but have not posted as yet, but feel I have to post in support of this excellent and well researched comment and am in full agreement with it. I also feel that whatever Party wins the election it will not effect the downward slope that leaving the EU will bring. I will vote LD because I feel I have no choice as I am a firm "remainer" and nothing can sway me from that.

I also feel that Political exchanges via social media are rather pointless..

So?

I don't feel comfortable with these "everyone out there's daft except me" type of discussions. I also feel that Political exchanges via social media are rather pointless..

"Speak up for what we believe is best for our children, grandchildren and our country."
I will speak up - Stop the triple lock on pensions - just because I'm a pensioner it doesn't mean I'll vote for a party that guarantees a triple lock - I'm not thinking of myself - I'm thinking of my children, grandchildren and those on low pay who have to fund it.
Why do politicians think we are so self-serving & greedy that we'll only vote for parties that offer us a bribe?

I'll see if I can spot any next time I walk past a Costa!