Are the UK electorate out of touch with reality?

And does this apply in the UK too?

Who are the 'elite'? and what have they done to upset the middle classes?

Oooh err! Asking Grayling or Scruton "What is reality?" would be interesting.

I've been claiming for ages that "left" and "right" are meaningless in current politics, but I guess I'm not an intellectual like either of those two, so nobody takes any notice.

I'm fairly sure that I've never called anybody who voted Leave deplorable or stupid, although I think some of the people behind the manipulation of public opinion are deplorable - they're certainly not stupid.

The term is being used of some politicians and experts of various flavours, dd, e.g. those who call people who vote for someone they dislike as "deplorables" or "stupid" or "far right" when, in reality, they are not those things.

I say in reality because, for instance, on the one hand you have a philosopher, A.C.Grayling, who thinks the Brexit vote was/is a disaster and another philosopher of equal intellectual standing, Roger Scruton, who admires the guts of people who voted for Brexit. Both can argue their case eloquently. So what is the 'reality'? Probably somewhere in the middle, as usual.

Whitewave I don't agree that political illiteracy 'boils down to inequality and poverty' it may be a part if it, but I think the greater part of it is more that people ( generally) are just not interested in politics as a subject, it comes very low down on their radar.
Inequality and poverty in the UK (compared to the past, and we all know that povery now is not what was classed as poverty in the past) is low.Education for all
Has eradicated a great deal of inequality.
You are either interested in politics or you are not.....most people are not.

So who do you think are the elitists thatbags? It seems to me it's a fairly meaningless term.

There is an argument that it's because of elitists calling people stupid, deplorable, right-wing, hard right, etc that people have, in effect, told the elitists to go boil their heads. We can't demand respect and then not respect people we disagree with.

Could you define what you regard as "reality", please, James? I've a feeling that there will be a range of views about it, just as there is about everything else.

Thank you folks, many fascinating comments. From my perception you are all doing a great job by at least airing your own views and making people think.
That in its self is an achievement, I am afraid this old codger gets rather concerned about the apathy in our society and the little thought a bought the future of our young people and attitudes from many politicians that we know what is best and it is a waste of time consulting with the electorate, we prefer to listen to the lobbyists and the City.

Please do keep up the debates, but with a little more consideration for future generations needs and desires.

James

"leftie" pops up here all the time ..surely its not leftie to want people treated with respect ,I read this morning about a woman who is disabled by a few illnesses including blind in one eye and heart problems ..she's had he electic wheelchair taken off her..so now she'll be confined to four walls as she cant walk any distance .I dont know about the rest of you but I'm bloody ashamed to live in a "country" that treats people this way

It isn't quite fair to call people politically illiterate. What is true though is that they are poorly educated, and don't feel that they have a stake in society -so why bother to inform themselves. Many do not bother to vote, and many vote by tabloid headlines as that is largely where they get their information from.

A lot boils down to inequality and poverty.

Anya tells us there are a lot of very stupid people out there. I was flabbergasted when I saw film director Guy Ritchie being asked on tv what he thought about Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn and he claimed he didn't know who they were, said he'd never heard of either of them. I'm hoping that was just a wind up.

I think that the tragedy is that those who have taken the brunt of the bankers cock up over the past 7 years, are also being taken as patsys over the Brexit cause. They have played nicely into the Hard rights hands in being persuaded in voting for it, but will soon find that once again they will have most to lose as the economy slows and inflation takes off.

The hard right ideological stance of a small state is coming along nicely - Britain will be unrecognisable in 10 years time.

Does it bags? Well there are a lot of Very Stupid People out there, so it's more a case of reporting facts than being judgemental.

So you think that the woman who didn't even know who JC was had an opinion about 'the issues'? Somehow I doubt it.

I shall be out of range today as travelling - dread to think how many pages I shall have to read when I can log on again!

Have a good day folks.

Oh dear, anya! That post sounds awfully elitist and judgmental about the hoi polloi!

I don't think one needs to know to which Party Jeremy Corbyn aligns himself to know what one thinks of the issues that one feels are important. JC isn't the whole of the Labour Party even if he is a bit of a drain on it. Ah...would that I could have said brain instead!

James2451 my impression is similar to yours. Of course my opinion is tainted by being a long time supporter of the Lib. Dems., a strong believer in PR and very much against Brexit. There are many flaws in the EU but as country we need to make our case from within and not sniping from the outside. Most of the so called problems can be laid squarely at the doors of Westminster rather than Brussels and traced back to the late 1940's.

The run down of manufacturing, over reliance on services and complacency are all reflections of the establishment. In the 40's and 50's the UK had a relatively strong position but instead of investing and innovating as the Germans and Japanese did they tried to get every last bit of profit out of old plant and models; productivity suffered.

The electorate has become disillusioned because under FPTP the majority simply feel their votes don't count so why bother. They therefore have lost interest in politics and feel ignored by the establishment. Swings from left to right are utterly destructive. As for Brexit the referendum was not so much anti EU but a chance to cock a snoop at the establishment, aggravated by rabble rousing lies all round.

We know from the past that Labour tend to leave a mess and the the Tories without a moderating influence pursue capitalism sometimes at the expense of the real national interest. So who do we vote for....there is no real answer!!!!

Out of touch with reality? Possibly.

Politically naive? Definitely.

Not a clue? Most certainly, judging by some of the comments on the street when being interviewed eg 'Jeremy Corbyn, which party's 'e then?'

This election is happening because of the EU referendum and the fact that David Cameron retired from being prime minister after it, so yes, in that respect, it must have a large element of Brexit in it and that element will be influencing how people vote. I've seen several people on Twitter say that, for them, the election is all about Brexit. Hardly surprising when the issue has exercised the nation so much over that last year.

I think all media contains biases. Of course it does since it is full of people's opinions. So read/listen widely and make judgments for yourself. It's people's own fault if they stick to one publication of 'news' and end up with prejudices and intolerances as a result. Well... maybe they were prejudiced and intolerant to begin with and that's why they self-limit their intake. Yes, I think that's probably more likely.

Of course there's more at stake Maizie. The Conservative Party is divided, but it's better at hiding its dirty washing from public gaze than the Labour Party. May is not popular with her back benchers, so wants to flood the HoC with people who will be loyal to her. Hence the "short lists" with which local Conservative Parties have been given. Strange isn't it (hmm] that the media hasn't made a big deal about what's been going on. Whenever the Labour Party has tried the same thing, a "hard left" take over has been headline news. Sad to say,some allegedly loyal Labour Party supporters have fallen for it.

We're going to have a Ukip-lite Conservative government for the next five years. Nobody except UK voters will be to blame - apart from the billionaires who've brainwashed them!

TM will claim that the election is about Brexit, but it isn't. It's about domestic policy and giving " Team May" a mandate to do what she wants. Unfortunately the result will be the same, because there isn't an effective opposition. It's tragic.

The turkeys who voted for Christmas will realise their mistake - too late.

I think totally the opposite to dbBd77. I don't think May particularly needed it for Brexit.
I think there is far more at stake here than Brexit. I think that our public services and our parliamentary democracy will be badly damaged by an overwhelming tory landslide. We are pretty sure that the tories will win but we desperately need them to have a strong opposition to curb May's obvious strong desire to be in charged and unopposed.

Apparently the vast majority of questions put to TM on the live FB session today were not about brexit but largely focussed on domestic policy, particularly the NHS.
The interview is available on the ITV website.

James - I think this General Election is and should be about Brexit. You may think I'm brainwashed but I believe that the outcome of the Brexit negotiations will have such a strong impact on our economy that it will determine what the Government (of whatever hue) is able to achieve. Other issues are dependent on our position post-Brexit.

rosesarered I found here a lot more factual as well.

Haha So the boards will never grow out of it then. Alas.