A Labour Government.

Each of those leading departments have a huge team behind them. What we should compare is how each would work with such a team - like with like. When you think of how badly some of the Conservative are doing in their office I think the Tory press has a bit of cheek - but then it was ever thus.

Oldwoman70 There is a saying "Set a thief to catch a thief"given his past history I would think Richard Murphy knows more about Tax avoidance than most people and I would suspect that HM Customs and Revenue are less likely to know who is fiddling the books and more likely to underestimate the amount in tax avoidance because it makes them look better. Even 2.7 billion would make a huge difference but I suspect it is more.

I really think Corbyn has done well in this election campaign. The Labour Manifesto is brave but realistic - starting with renationalising the railways as franchises come up for renewal and aiming to reverse much of the Tory Austerity in schools, policing and health. All very popular policies.

He is a passionate and rousing speaker. He has been able to tread that fine line of diplomacy and remained calm (and strong!) under questioning. So he may well prove to be a better Brexit negotiator than May and Davies.

There's a poll in the Independent (I'll find the link later) about how much better remembered the Labour Manifesto is than the Conservative one among voters as it has positive rather than negative policies.

On another thread quite recently somebody referred to Corbyn as The Messiah. I don't see the point of these nicknames but when Corbyn is referred to in these deregatory terms it is not surprising that other people get annoyed and use the same tactics.

I haven't noticed a wealth of competence in the Conservative cabinet. The abilities of Boris Johnson, for instance, are very questionable. He was given a very important position, requiring sensitivity, integrity and diplomacy. That doesn't exactly fit in with him going to a Sikh temple and making ill-judged remarks about whisky exports, nor the recent incident where he was caught rifling through an interviewer's papers to find out what questions were going to be asked of him.

Anniebach I hope you have relinquished your Labour Party membership. Is your local party aware that you have spent the whole of the election campaign on a fairly widely read website rubbishing Labour?

Has Richard Murphy's view of Corbyn Economics since 2016?
Has it what?

Read the website.

This is why we need a Labour government.

think-left.org/2017/05/28/rebuilding-britain-for-people-votelabour/

It's about ideas, not personalities, although how anyone can still think Mayhem is better than Corbyn is beyond me.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2016/07/17/the-rise-and-fall-of-corbyns-economics/

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/27/jeremy-corbyn-labour-party-opposition

" Corbyn once used my ideas, but I have lost faith in his vision"
Richard Murphy

Has Richard Murphy's view of Corbyn Economics since 2016?

Ginny, I'll stop calling May Mayhem when Annie stops calling McDonnell McDonald, and all that that implies.

He may now regret what he did and I fully accept he probably is (I didn't get my information from Wikipedia as I don't consider it an accurate source of information).

However he has got his figure wrong in tax avoidance (if you accept H M Inland Revenue figures).

I don't understand your reference to my prejudice. All I am doing is following the advice of a much more political savvy person than myself who told me that when someone makes a statement you should not only check their source but check the source of that source.

You may be surprised at the number so called "independent" sources that are run by politically biased people - of all parties.

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20160612044958/https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/470540/HMRC-measuring-tax-gaps-2015-1.pdf#page=13

Total tax gap in government figures 2014-5 given as £34 billion. If they've managed to collect £30+ billion since then, where has it gone?

There has been much dismissive talk on threads over Theresa May's 'inabilty to cope' .

This past couple of weeks she has dealt with COBRA Meetings and the Manchester Bombing, this week alone attended both the NATO and G27 SUMMITS.

I for one would have no faith in the Labour Shadow Cabinet as it stands taking part part in any of the 3.

Corbyn / Emily Thornberry at a NATO Summit, Corbyn / John McDonnell at a G7 meeting and as for Corbyn / Dianne Abbott dealing with the Manchester Bombing as PM and Home Secretary !

I find the persistent talk of fat cats , bankers, the wealthy one time is an odd one to be honest.

I remember when the 2008 crash happened how the 'wails' of the " We don't care if the banks all buggered off " brigade were spouting their lot. Then along comes the EU Referendum and the same "We don't care if they all buggered off brigade" were shouting "We can't do without them".

I fully understand the debate over the flouting of / evasion of tax revenue but it is also extremely disingenuous not to accept the top paying tax percentage equates to in the region of 25% - 27% of tax intake.

The rhetoric of hitting hard the 'fat cats', 'big buisiness', is fine if you can ' guarantee ' your way of doing things does not lead to an exodus of job / wealth creators / entrepreneurial spirit that keeps the country in jobs and supports the likes of the NHS, Education through tax revenues.

To my mind the talk of raising taxes should not be done for Class Warfare nor Ideology but on the basis of sound economics and everything tells me that Corbyn/McDonnell et al are more interested in the first not the latter.

When hackles are up with hackneyed name calling there’s a risk tempers will flare and we will neglect serious discussion of the choices facing voters very soon.

It’s perhaps a difficult choice between the two main parties for some - but fortunately we live in a country where there is choice, although it may not straightforward.

The Conservatives have aggressively stripped the public sector and plan to pare it some more. We have run down our manufacturing industries and are over reliant on finance. Multinationals are allowed to get away with tax evasion and avoidance and we’ve sold off most of our utilities. Labour wants to bring many of those utilities back under the control of a government machine already charged with the mammoth challenges of Brexit. How will that work out?

The biggest error from the Conservatives in my view is making policy on the hoof, not even discussing it with Tory MPs; i.e. using the value of your house above £100,000 to fund social care should you need it. NI was established on the premise of spreading the cost for health care to everyone; it seems unfair to separate social care from health care. In a civilised society we should take care of people who need care. What is the plan going forward for the younger generation who can’t afford a house and may rent all their lives? Need more information.

Labour, having been challenged repeatedly to demonstrate financial credibility, has costed each of its proposals, saying they would be funded through raising taxes rather than borrowing. TM on the other hand says, we’ll disclose our finances in the budget. Nicely side-stepped that one.

The gap between the two continues to narrow and I'm hoping for at least a very much reduced majority for the Tories, so they realise there is a massive ground-swell of resistance/repulsion even,(i.e.attitude towards the disabled/the poorest) towards to some of their policies.

fairtaxmark.net/manifesto-tracker/

One of the things that Murphy set up.

Perhaps you could see him as a balancing source Oldwomen. We do get a lot of right-wing economics that serves big business thrown at us rather a lot.

Been reading Wikipedia.

"For much of his early career he was an accountant in Downham Market, Norfolk. In 1985 he co-founded an accountancy firm which became Murphy Deeks Nolan. The company was sold in 2000. Murphy was also the founder of a company that became the European distributor for the game Trivial Pursuit.[4] Murphy has since admitted that the manufacturing operation he set up in Ireland to manufacture Trivial Pursuit was there to avoid UK taxation, something of which he is now ashamed and was a turning point in his career towards anti-tax avoidance campaigning."

You omitted the rest of it.

You said you would believe me if I was a tax accountant. I am hardly unbiased.
You never asked me for an unbiased source, did you?

He was the founder member of a company set up to distribute the game Trivial Pursuit - he admitted that he set up the manufacturing company in Ireland in order to avoid UK taxes

durhamjen - I didn't say I didn't read him just that I don't think he is an unbiased source. How am I showing prejudice by questioning a source?

Can you show me where Murphy had admitted to setting up a manufacturing operation in Ireland to avoid taxes?
He is Irish, has an Irish passport, but lives here in East Anglia, and pays his taxes.

Okay, don't read him then, oldwoman. I really don't care. You are showing your prejudice.
You said you would believe me if I was a tax accountant. Murphy is. He's also a lecturer at City University.
He doesn't advise Corbyn or McDonnell.

Luckylegs9 You are free of course to vote how you like but if we don't have a Labour government and you have voted Tory can ask if you accept responsibility for:
disabled and vulnerable people suffering
more homeless on our streets
more working families using food banks
longer waiting times and waiting lists in the NHS
fewer doctors and nurses
overcrowded classrooms and understaffed schools
rocketing rail fares and increasing profits for rail companies (who are publicly subsidised)
more crime and violence
more fuel poverty as the poorest are unable to pay fuel bills
fat cats at the top pocketing huge amounts of money from the privatisation of the NHS and other public services.
If you are voting Tory with the full knowledge that these things will happen and you really don't care that's fine, but I don't understand how you sleep at night. If you are voting Tory for any other reason then take a close look at what has happened since they came to power.

sorry that should of course be taxresearch.org.uk (fat fingers)

I looked up taxresearch.otg.uk and it appears it is run by Richard Murphy who campaigns on the issues of tax avoidance and tax evasion, he advises the Trades Union Congress and many of his ideas have been taken up by Jeremy Corbyn.

He has admitted to setting up a manufacturing operation in Ireland to avoid UK taxes.

He claims £25 billion is lost annually to tax avoidance whereas HM Customs and Revenue say it is more like £2.7 billion.

The Institute for Fiscal Studies have stated his estimate of the corporate tax gap is overstated by a wide margin.

Not what I would consider an unbiased source

Maggie, I understand your fears of a Tory government, I share them, but the promises coming from Corbyn are now out of control, they cannot all be carried out so which will be dropped ? Since Thursday he has added thousands more police, massive increase in security branches,All this from taxing the few and assurance there will be no tax increases for the many, even free music lessons in all school and free school meals for all , no university fees for England , what will he promise next week?

labourlist.org/2017/05/labour-must-make-clear-that-the-tories-have-cut-the-armed-forces-to-the-bone-writes-former-navy-commodore/

This is an interesting read by someone standing for the Labour party in Cornwall.

Can I thank you for the paragraphs too Oldwomen; it really does make it easier to read.