Government watch

Go on then, Jalima.
I was talking to Cindersdad not you djen
It's rude to butt in - and you seem to have developed a habit of telling people to go - on many threads.

Do you work for GNHQ these days?

Well, we can but hope!

I think, having seen the past 18 months or so, there is a prospect of anything. It may initially be a vote in the HoP but they must know they could loose an election if they were pushed into it by loosing a vote in Parliament.

I am not sure TM will even be around by then. It will depend on how incontinent those vying for her job are. They have so far been very happy to flood the note books of any passing journalist. I think we will get a couple of weeks of peace from them, a month if we at lucky and then, no doubt she will be knifed in the back at some point, just like Thatcher.

I don't know if anyone saw the amusing 'end of term' horoscopes on the Daily Politics but apparently August is a very inauspicious month for TM

I agree Tegan but TM seems determined to 'do a Thatcher' and keep going regardless.

Surely questions have to be asked when even one of the people who stood in front of 'that bus' is now saying there should never have been a referendum? Even though they, like Cameron have 'done a runner' ...

Yes GG but sadly I can't see any propect of TM calling a second vote. She's like a horse with blinkers on.

Is there any prospect of 'a vote'? Really?

In some ways I feel we have moved on from the lies. They happened and I am sure we all know they happened. I would want the vote on the exit terms though, especially because of the narrow margin in the referendum (60% seems to be what most countries use to change the status quo) and the previous misleading information. It would be more difficult (but not impossible) to spin that as we would have facts.

What second vote?

It only needs enough people to concede that they were misled and change to remain to put the brakes on through a second vote though, tegan

But how many people refuse to admit that they believed lies? Or say they knew they were lies but voted for other reasons? Or don't even think about it any more because 'they won'and that's an end to it?

ABSOLUTELY AGREE dj

Idiotic to vote leave on the lies they were told. Fortunately some now wish they haven't. The most important thing is for us to have another vote on the exit terms.

Pardon me for being nosey but didn't you vote remain but then publicly thanked people who voted leave? I found it difficult to understand at the time. Most of us who voted remain felt very strongly about it and still do so you'll have to forgive the things we say sometimes.

Go on then, Jalima.
Personally, I would hate to spend time in a roomful of people who voted Brexit. Fortunately, I don't have to.

those imbeciles who voted leave
That is extremely rude

No wonder remainers are called remoaners by some.
Thanks - but I don't want to be a remoaner and would never call someone with a different opinion to me an 'imbecile'.

I think I would rather spend time with a roomful of people who voted Brexit than with someone who called others 'imbeciles' because they disagree.

kittysjones.wordpress.com/2017/07/19/the-debate-on-tuition-fees-today-was-a-prime-example-of-tory-abuse-and-bullying/

I just get told not to upset those imbeciles who voted leave by my friends most of whom voted remain. Civil (well not so civil) war is likely to break out.

Most of my REMAINER friends have resigned themselves to quietly letting it all go wrong and not saying a word.

Times

HMRC are demanding the social care industry pay back 6years of back pay. This will almost certainly mean that many of the charities will implode.
178k people with special needs may have their assistance at home withdrawn because of the change in pay.

The charities are desperate to talk to ministers involved who apparently have no time in their diaries for ordinary work because of Brexit!!!
I seem to remember that when there was a suggestion that leaving Europe would leave no room for government we were told that we were scaremongering.

I feel as if I am spending all day banging my head against a brick wall

Good for them, whitewave. I did wonder if it was legal, let alone moral, which it obviously isn't.

Kuenssburg on twitter

Irish and Scottish governments have started a formal dispute resolution over the Westminster governments deal with the DUP

Todays announcement about increased pension age, the BBC wages revelations and the statistics about increased births by mothers not born in the UK will give the tabloids plenty to froth about while other nastier things slip in under the radar....Prison Officers no longer permitted to strike, ALL juvenille detention centres being assessed as unsafe, criminal compensation being refused to children victims of sexual abuse....the list of nasty, vile things goes on and on, just when will people wake up to what is happening? I am no fan of Corbyn, but this current cabal are beyond belief. I truly despair not just about what is happening, but the fact not many people are concerned that it is happening.

Like May took the credit today for bringing in the national living wage, which isn't at all, and asked what Labour had done for the poor workers.
Labour brought in the minimum wage, which she voted against.

politicalscrapbook.net/2017/07/theresa-may-asked-when-labour-ever-gay-workers-a-pay-rise-try-the-minimum-wage-that-she-voted-against/

She also voted against tuition fees of £3000. Quickly forgot about that, didn't she?

The increase in the tax-free personal allowance was indeed a LibDem policy which they had to fight for in the coalition government, only to find the Tories taking credit for it in 2015.

It was also a Lib Dem policy if I remember correctly Jen. They seem to have got themselves in such a muddle about what they believe in - other than not wanting to appear nasty while being nasty - that they have become policy incompetent.

The tax point is now set at what many agree is the minimum you should have to live on to be part of society so jolly dee, you are allowed to keep that. I will also be more inclined to see them as in any way competent when the basic State Pension is also £11,500 and then they can talk about rich pensioners to their hearts content. There are still (possibly more so) many who do not earn enough or are not offered (or both) a 'good' pension. An £11,500 pension would mean huge savings in benefits too.