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Let's not forget Brexit

(1001 Posts)
Cindersdad Tue 03-Oct-17 19:16:18

I still feel that Brexit is wrong though have no idea how stop it. We get mixed messages on the negotiations, DD says that are going fine but the EU side says otherwise.

There was a protest in Manchester where Lib. Dems., European Movement. Open Britain and other groups made their feelings clear.

Our democracy and standard of living is under threat from dogmatism on both the left and the right.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 19:17:12

There's an obvious difference anyway.
Great Britain could leave if Northern Ireland stays in.
The UK is the united kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Welshwife Tue 31-Oct-17 19:15:57

I think Scotland will have another referendum to leave the UK - and probably it would be successful. Not sure what Wales would do - they need the grants for various things.

Jalima1108 Tue 31-Oct-17 19:13:27

Wales voted Brexit - 52.5% in favour of leaving and 47.5% wanting to remain.

mostlyharmless Tue 31-Oct-17 19:11:35

If Northern Ireland stays in EU what happens to Scotland? They wouldn't be happy.
Then Wales?...........

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 19:11:15

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-remain-voters-better-educated-labour-mp-barry-sheerman-huddersfield-yougov-facts-leave-a8027121.html

Just to annoy Brexiteers.

Welshwife Tue 31-Oct-17 19:06:15

I was in OZ in 1992 and the people there considered that they built no cars as the number produced was so small compared with the numbers sold and on the road - the imports from Japan were by then ramping up.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 18:35:52

infacts.org/fox-must-prioritise-copying-eus-existing-trade-deals/

Who do you think Fox should pretend to be doing trade deals with?

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 18:26:41

infacts.org/goves-farm-fish-plan-torpedo-transition/

Gove's plans will cause problems for Northern Ireland.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 18:16:49

Northern Ireland could remain in the EU. They did vote for it.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 18:15:57

That would be up to the rest of the EU, who might not agree to it.

Jalima1108 Tue 31-Oct-17 18:11:44

1,000 not 1,00

mostlyharmless Tue 31-Oct-17 18:11:09

So would mainland Britain have open borders with the whole of Ireland? And tariff-free trade and free movement?

I would think that's the only way it could work.

Jalima1108 Tue 31-Oct-17 18:09:07

Australia did not make cars for long
I think car production went on for many years in Asutralia

The origins go back to 1885, the year Germany's Gottlieb Daimler and Karl Benz "invented the car". That same year, South Australia brothers David and John Shearer started building their own self-powered jalopy. It took them 11 years, and it turned out to be a crude, steam-powered adaption of a 12-seater carriage.

The industry was partly rescued when a WWI ruling made it harder to bring in complete motor vehicles. Independent locals, such as Holden's Motor Body Builders, signed contracts with overseas car makers. In time, these local body-builders developed unique designs, including a proto-hatchback. Famously, Ford Australia turned out the "ute".

Ford and Holden - epitomised in the Bathurst 1,00, now open to other makes as well. If you don't like cars or noise then best to avoid and turn off the tv when this takes place.

Sorry, but Australia had a thriving car industry which has now been totally closed down and let us hope that the UK car industry does not go the same way.

(not flaming - it is related to Brexit!)

Welshwife Tue 31-Oct-17 18:06:17

It would be a great pity to reinstate a border after all the time and trouble taken by so many over the Good Friday agreement. I would rather see them do that than go back to fighting etc.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 17:59:15

The only way round it I have seen is for Northern Ireland to vote for a united Ireland, which will solve the border problem.
Apparently 60% will go along with that in the last article I saw about it.

mostlyharmless Tue 31-Oct-17 17:41:44

It's a bit of a mess really isn't it dj?

jura2 Tue 31-Oct-17 17:37:27

The UK did opt out of many key aspects of the EU- Schengen and the Euro. And of course it could have chosen to limit immigration to a very large extent- but chose not to do so.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 16:26:31

Mostlyharmless, the government is scared about Northern Ireland. They have performed another u-turn. No idea what to do.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/northern-ireland-power-sharing-deadline-dup-sinn-fein-talks-deal-stormont-james-brokenshire-a8028731.html

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 15:43:48

By the way, it just shows how bothered our MPs are about sovereignty. They are debating the finance bill at the moment and there are about 30 in the house. So concerned that they can't be bothered to show up for a bill that they have complete control over.

durhamjen Tue 31-Oct-17 15:41:34

Day6, do you never read anything you do not agree with, or do you forget it straight away?

EVERY EU country has opt-outs. They ALL can opt out of things they do not agree with, so keep their sovereignty.

The EU is a conglomerate of sovereign countries. That just shows how willingly you were mislead by the main Brexiteers.

GracesGranMK2 Tue 31-Oct-17 13:41:19

"Hah. It is considered the most positive thing the UK has embarked on by the majority of citizens."

Those who keep throwing this view in the direction of others who don't agree seem to be very poor at maths. This was a majority of 4%. It was 52/48 not 70/30. I know you are pleased you did get a majority but comments made to those who do not want the country they see as 'their country' taken away from them are totally out of proportion.

Day6 Tue 31-Oct-17 13:18:28

Cinders - Fingers crossed the nightmare may just end.

Hah. It is considered the most positive thing the UK has embarked on by the majority of citizens. Why should the Brexit process end and democracy be overturned just because you are a Remainer?

Taking us out of the EU is the mandate of the people. We ALL had a vote and Remain MPs would be wise to remember that fact.

Day6 Tue 31-Oct-17 13:08:09

Yes me too Baggs.

I as reading an interesting article by an Italian MP Daniele Capezzone and Federico Punzi, a journalist, this morning which says the EU must learn from Brexit and what we gain in leaving and urgently needs to reform.

It likened the EU to a cage.

Interestingly, I wasn't aware that in Germany, there are constitutional courts which can repeal or overturn EU rules. They can opt-out, so Germany has a measure of sovereignty already and does not have to abide by everything coming out of Brussels.

No wonder Frau Merkel waves the EU flag.

Cindersdad Tue 31-Oct-17 13:00:42

"Baggs" we have to believe that we can collectively ExitBrexit. The Guardian and Independent regularly feature anti Brexit articles. Even the Times and Telegraph have their moments. Groups like Open Britain and the European Movement have local as well as national meetings. I have to yet hear an argument in favour of Brexit that strikes me a rational let alone one I could support. Fingers crossed the nightmare may just end.

The present sleaze episodes in parliament may get rid of a few Brexiteer MP's or at least destroy their credibility. If it can be shown that the Russians contributed to UKIP the whole thing could collapse.

Checkout reasons2remain.eu you may find the site interesting. There is so much we don't know and so much the government is not admitting to us.

Baggs Tue 31-Oct-17 12:10:46

EVERY time I see this thread title on the Active page I think this: "As if we could!"

Just saying ?

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