Are older people today out of touch politically with younger generations?

'Are older people today out of touch politically with younger generations?'

Equally if the question was 'Are younger people out of touch politically with the older generation ' then I would respond the same way.

I have no idea because whoever you ask they will hold their own opinion .

What I do however find since Corbyn and Brexit the nasty / divisive politics of setting one age group against the other is corrosive for our society.

GGMK2 - "perhaps the odd brexiteer would be able to talk more fluently about just how the EU works and what our government, along with their Parliament has achieved"

Well, we aren't getting that from Remainers, either, are we? Blinkered once again. Can those who want to Remain in the EU answer questions about it's make up? We pay to be in it remember.

I outlined just four parts of the EU make up and it would need me to write an essay and do heck of a lot of online research to be able to say clearly and with full understanding what each section did, who presided over it, what was the make up of the body, who elected them, where are they from, what is their remit, where is any agenda for their meetings, what are their political leanings and how do we get rid of them if they don't serve us well. That, times four, at least.

Who could do that confidently and explain with authority?

If you want to remain in the EU and pay billions for that dubious privilege you should be able to explain clearly and precisely how each part of it operates. Most people cannot give you this information. I don't have the answers. I want to leave because the EU is opaque and unaccountable and gargantuan. I do not know who is making decisions or whether I approve of the decision makers.

Saying "You have an MEP" is not enough when their are hundreds of them, each with an agenda and representing countries which vary greatly in culture, outlook, prosperity and of course language.

You GG, are back once again to sneering and asking Leavers for a thesis/assignment. Perhaps Remainers could do that work for you and us. Enlighten us.

"Out for themselves and to hell with any kind of democracy for those who disagree with them."

What should we do? Apologise?
We had a referendum. Two choices.
We voted as we saw fit.

Being bitter because the Leave vote was greater isn't in anyway the fault of Leavers, is it? Democracy in action, even though it was close.

If it had been a football match which ended 7-6, the team with seven goals win. No question. They do not replay the game until the losing team win and call that the result. It doesn't matter how much the losing side protest if the rules were followed.

There were going to be winners and losers with the referendum. It's tough being on the losing side but the prolonged bitterness serves no purpose.

Where is James? and is he enjoying all this?

That’s a rather rude and sweeping statement from you there M0nica encompassing as it does ALL those on this forum and in the UK who voted to leave.
We all had a vote, and most of us voted for what we thought was best for our country whichever way we voted.

How many MPs, and senior civil servants would you recognise if they were sitting next to you in the pub?

I do not think anyone is suggesting that the EU is perfectly run, what we are saying that working in cencert with other countries in close co-operation is best for us and them.

Other countries are as dissatisfied with the way the EU as we are. If David Cameron, had gone into to ask for real reform of the EU instead of selfish dickering aroundtrying to get us treated as first among equals, he could really have done some good for not just us but others.

But I forget the 17 million Brexiteers have been treating the 16 million remainers (and 13 million non voters) with the same contempt they treat everybody else. Out for themselves and to hell with any kind of democracy for those who disagree with them.

Surely if we assume that there are at least some on here are fairly knowledgeable about what people do which jobs in our government. If that is true you have to ask why there isn't an equal awareness of those working for us and the way the jobs are done in the European Parliament.

The only people who constantly want to tell us about the structure of the EU are the gutter press like the DM It is noticeable that the rather childish language used in that paper is often used by those on forums who want to leave the EU on here but don't even start to understand how our democracy works.. We rarely get knowledgable argument from leavers, on here or elsewhere, just urban myths and name calling.

If our own governments had bought into what we and they decided to join, and had made sure we knew which parts of the country were benefiting, etc., while they just made the areas decimated by Thatcher and those that came after her even more distressing places to live, perhaps the odd brexiteer would be able to talk more fluently about just how the EU works and what our government, along with their Parliament has achieved.

PS to the above.

We also know the names of the government MPs and their roles, and those of the Shadow Cabinet.

Has any body explored Google to find the names and roles of every member of the ....erm...let me go back and check the names of these bodies..

1) European Council
2) Council of the European Union
3) European Commission
4) European Parliament.

Do we know, do we care? Who is electing the people who sit on these councils? It's not me, that's for sure.

Do I know what they look like?
Could I pick any of them out in a line-up? No.
Do I like their politics? I haven't a clue.

The EU is a massive, expensive, faceless organisation.

Much EU legislation is EU legislation because our parliament saw no point in reinventing the wheel and putting through our parliament legislation that would undoubtedly have been incorporated in to UK legislation had it not always been legislated for by the EU. That is why our parliament has passed an Act to incorporate much of the EU legislation into UK law.

Having tried to get information out of my MP and been involved in the planning process, your opinion of the transparency of our government at any level is much higher than mine.

I would never argue that the EU system was perfect, I am quite happy to admit that it has many failings, but so does the UK system, but on the balance of probabilities I would sooner be in than out.

MOnica, my asking about the make up of the EU was a sort of rhetorical question, aimed at no one in particular.

You could very well ask the same questions of our own parliament and yes, it too is multi-layered, but our structure is fairly transparent. We have regional and local councils which see to local affairs, and I'd bet we all know our MPs and could insist on getting information if we wanted it. We can also sit in at many meetings, at local government level and central government too. Meetings for my local council are published along with the names of committee members. It's much more transparent and accessible and administrators of the whole shebang can be found on local government sites.

I wouldn't know who to find or where to find them if I wanted to explore the EU set up. I wouldn't know where to begin. I don't ant my MEP to be the only person in the region who has that knowledge. I'd like to be a fly on the wall and see exactly what MEPs do to earn their salary and expenses.

We have our parliament and we pay Brussels too. I am a Leaver. I do not see the need or benefits of two governing bodies. I am appalled we accept EU limitations, EU legislation, EU tariffs and EU T&Cs. We pay billions to be part of it too.

Day6 do you know about all about the Select Committees and all the other supra parliamentary organisations in the British Parliament? How many changes in British law and procedure are issued through ministries with out going through parliament. When you know all those, I will have a go at Brussels.

When we heard the result of the referendum. I accepted the result. I assumed that the winning side would take cognizance of how close the vote was and in justice and fairness would take the strong remain vote into consideration in the negotiations for Brexit, but, well, we have seen what has happened.

You are on the spot: Your starter for ten. Tell us now what their roles are and how they differ from each other? Yes, Google well may be your friend and explain them but does it make much sense to any of us?

The Commission is the equivalent of our civil service. There are 46,000 of them, appointed from all nationalities. As opposed to 380,000 UK civil servants. Are you able to explain in detail the roles and functions of that 380,000? Broadly, they draft the laws proposed by Parliament and administer the laws; EU civil servants do the same thing. And they do it according to the wishes of the elected heads of governments in the EU council and the EU Parliament.

The fact that you don't understand how a large organisation works, Day6 doesn't automatically make it evil, corrupt or a 'gravy train'

Wilma yes, this thread is going way off course.

You really do come across as an aggressive Remainer GG
( that is not personal criticism btw) it is how you come across to me.

It's young when it comes to voting for Jeremy Corbyn NfkD. I think they discovered that the 'youff' vote that was declared to be the reason why he did as well as he did was something like between 24 and 47. (I haven't checked it).

I have children in their 40s with children, mortgages and lots of hard work in their lives and I would hardly call this their youth.

We also have 19 to 21 year olds and seven and nine. I would be interesting to know the ages at James's lunch.

650 MPs Day and my MP is Keith Simpson. I have no idea how many MEPs there are. No idea what countries have how many. How it's decided or what any of them stand for. Or who my MEP is. I know s/he covers a very large area. It's largely irrelevant to me. What happens in Brussels or wherever they are at present is somewhere else in the universe. I know they influence my life, but I have no influence or knowledge of them. I did actually ask my Remainer DD who her MEP is and what she knew of EU workings - and she's no wiser than me. It's nice to know the young can be ignorant too. Although at 43 is she still young?

Thanks for yet more personal criticism of me GG

That is not personal criticism - yet alone more. It is how you come across to me. I did not say it is how you are.

Yes, Nonnie - where's James2451

"Light blue touch paper and retire"

Nearly fell off my chair, as you forgot to put the quote in inverted comas or italics ahahahaha - oh it did make me chuckle.

Looks like you've had the last word twice Wilma well done, enjoy.

I'm off this thread now as it has nothing to do with the OP and the OP made an attack and then didn't respond when asked to justify. Too late if he comes back now days later as I won't be reading it. Same old, same old.

You really do come across as a very aggressive Brexiteer.

Thanks for yet more personal criticism of me GG. It's becoming par for the course with you, isn't it?

I am a pussycat really. In 'real life' I am genial and very laid back. We all know that emotion and tone cannot always be conveyed accurately via the written word. You don't read people very well. There is a difference between aggression and passion. I perhaps write passionately about leaving the EU but without ill will. Others do exactly the same but are spared your opprobrium.

I shouldn't have to explain myself to you.

Petra of course ?. No wonder countries like Poland love the EU they pay nothing in but receive big handouts.

I said last night that I didn't see the point of this thread if we're just going to rehash the pros and cons of Brexit. Despite what I said I've been drawn into a Brexit discussion, so I'm not responding to any posts now that subject.

Day6 how many people know the name of their local MP or how our own parliament works? How many don't care that they don't know?

I know Google is my friend, but so is Europa.eu. I've worked with EU groups as part of the UK team and I understand how things work. I know about the deals done behind closed doors to secure the necessary votes to achieve objectives. I know the EU is an inefficient body. But I also know that reform is happening and has been since 2014. Just last week Junker (who I can't stand) announced who will be on the Task Force on Subsidiarity and Proportionality that will report by July in preparation for the release of the white paper on the future of Europe. Unsurprisingly the UK is not one of the 6 task force members and I'm not sure if the UK will even be consulted given Brexit is only 14 months away. So we will not be able to influence the reform process. I voted Remain because I think the UK is better in the EU than out and we've thrown the baby out with the bath water by voting to leave.

Juncker appointed six members to the 'Task Force on Subsidiarity, Proportionality and "Doing Less More Efficiently"

Oh so many of your unsubstantiated opinions and yet you object to one opinion from someone else Day6. You really do come across as a very aggressive Brexiteer.