Are older people today out of touch politically with younger generations?

I hope the OP can show his young relatives that older people do indeed think about issues long and hard.

This thread is fast turning into the merits or otherwise of the EU and is no longer about the role older people play in the system.

"As I said, as far as Brexiteers are concerned it is 'I'm alright Jack' (and b*gger take the hindmost)"

That is YOUR opinion as a Remainer MOnica.

I believe, as I have said before, the EU does exactly the opposite of what you state above. The EU shafts the man on the street and needs a migrant workforce (no borders) to keep wages low and the working man competing for jobs and taking anything they can get. The EU plays into
the hands of capitalists (all remainers) making massive profits for the already wealthy whilst those with least remain the poorest.

Getting out should be a left wing cause. Jeremy Corbyn is a Eurosceptic, but sadly one who is happy to sit on the fence in order to retain his seat.

M0nica I couldn't agree more and I haven't accepted the referendum result as a fait accompli. Not one bit.

"The so called 'unknown bureaucrats' are known to our representatives in Europe, e.g. Mr Farage. MEPs are there to represent us. We voted for them"

That means very little really when you look at the composition of the EU.

How many British MEPs are there? How many MEPs are there in the European Parliament? Which country has the greatest number?

Whats the difference between the European Council, and the Council of the European Union?

There is also a European Parliament and the European Commission. What are their roles. How are they made up?

You are on the spot: Your starter for ten. Tell us now what their roles are and how they differ from each other? Yes, Google well may be your friend and explain them but does it make much sense to any of us?

Add to that the hundreds of agencies and committees which sit alongside them and thousands of well-paid bureaucrats on the gravy train.

To the outsider transparency and accountability is impossible. We have to trust that the EU is working for us but we have very little chance of calling this bureaucratic behemoth to account.

There aren't enough hours in a day to get to the bottom of what is going on where and who is working for whom. It's a complex, labyrinthine set up, designed to confuse. That makes it pretty much unaccountable to the people it supposedly serves.

And we are one of the largest contributors to this colossal organisation. As mentioned above we pay in far more than we get back.

Ask your Remain friends for an explanation of how the system works and the roles of the various bodies in Brussels and Strasbourg. They'll flounder without a doubt.

It's like throwing money at a drain.

Nonnie I only asked about your last sentence, but given there's support for the public having a say on the final deal it's not absurd. Did you miss the news yesterday about the announcement of the cross party group led by Chuka Umunna?

Pro-EU Campaign Groups Join Forces

I know how wealthy Esher is, but your joke fell flat because your sentence has nothing to do with the discussion. Let's just leave it.

73 MEPs. How many British bureacrats, you cannot exclude them.

Anyway, that is no different to almost any other parliament, including our own. How many Scots Nats, Plaid Cymru, various Irish parties, Lib Dems etc etc . How representative is our current leading political party, or the main opposition of the country as a whole.

How representative are those who voted Brexit ? 17.4 million voted out, 16.1 voted remain and 12.9 million didn't vote at all. When most votes are this close the views of the minority are usually taken into account, in deciding how the majority vote should be implemented. I have yet to hear a single Brexiteer accept that the opinions of the 16.1 deserve to be considered.

As I said, as far as Brexiteers are concerned it is 'I'm alright Jack' (and b*gger take the hindmost)

OK Wilma in the simplest possible terms:

The suggestion of a referendum about a referendum was absurd therefore could not be taken seriously.

Esher and Walton is a very, very wealthy area therefore it seems unlikely that the MP from that area would not understand the housing needs of the whole country. This last was to show that I do not particularly attach to any political party and am quite happy to whinge about all of them.

Hopefully that was understandable, if not then I must give up. I had assumed that some sort of subtlety would be appreciated.

"The UK is an integral a part of the EU decision making"

Of course it is, but as someone who wants us out of the EU I believe it's a middleman we can cut out. Why does our decision making, our thoughts on spending have to be agreed and ratified by 27 European countries, each with their own agenda and each looking after their own interests?

It is a fact that we pay much more into the EU pot than we receive in rebates. We should be in control of our own spending and determine where UK taxpayers money goes.

Nonnie you're right, I missed the humour in your post and I still haven't got a clue what you're talking about. Never mind, I can't be bothered with trying to get you to explain anymore.

ninny
I don't suppose the fact that Poland has 50 MEPs has anything to do with them being the largest recipients of eu funds

The point I am making is that these 678 MEPs unlike our MPs who the British people have voted in do not represent us. We are one of the largest contributors to the EU but others countries like Romania have 30 plus, Poland 50 plus etc MEPs all looking out for their own interests not Britains. That's one of the reasons I voted Leave.

Wilma so sorry you missed the humour in my post. I didn't think it needed spelling out in simple terms. Perhaps the suggestion about a referendum about a referendum was a clue?

Also, as I didn't name the MP concerned that might give a clue to the fact that I neither knew nor cared who he was? The emphasis, which you appear to have missed, was on Esher and Walton! As you clearly don't understand perhaps you could look at house prices on Rightmove which will make it very clear.

Always happy to explain to those unable to understand

Nonnie the last sentence in your post yesterday at 10.40 says

No, don't Tories, their new Housing Minister is MP for Esher and Waltong, what does he know about the average person?!

Dominic Raab is the MP for Esher and Walton.

They are only 73 British MEPs and 678 unknown bureaucrats MEPs so Day 6 in correct. 678 unknown not voted in by us.

So how many civil servants do you think work in the background in our Parliament Ninny. I can't see the point you are making. MEPs are MEPs and those we usually call civil servants are civil servants.

They are only 73 British MEPs and 678 unknown bureaucrats MEPs so Day 6 in correct. 678 unknown not voted in by us.

Day I don't think you should minimize the effect of Brexit on the pound. Before the vote the £ was worth $, it went down to about 1.22$ and is now up to 1.42$. That is significant.

Thanks for correcting that MaizieD, it was a surprise to me that the EU decided who we gave aid to.

Petra are you sure they learned from the Russians...lol.I know Irish farmers who got grants and built huge houses with them instead of spending it as intended.I think there are people who will do this everywhere.Its the grants to huge estates that bothers me Queenie and co get a huge windfall from the EU every year as do many of our esteemed MP's

Wilma never heard of Dominic Raab! Wasn't me who mentioned him

I wasn't very happy when I lived in Bulgaria and our local farming co- operative was given 20 million euros to up date all their farm machinery and the whole lot just 'disappeared'
There were dozens of these incidents but this one I know to be true as my friend farmed on this land and had such high hopes that things were going to change, but sadly they didn't.
The eu regularly sent officials to try and find where the money had gone but these people run rings round them. They learnt from their previous task masters, the Russians.

.....and Day6 probably just summed up the views of the other half of the country.

Thu 01-Feb-18 19:50:42 Well said Monica. You probably just summed up the views of half the country.

Day6, I said nothing about foreign aid. I was talking about the money invested by the EU in other EU countries.

You talk as if the EU was a group the UK gave money to but had no involvement in the decision making. The UK is an integral a part of the EU decision making, as much as any other country and we have British Commissioners, the equivalent of Cabinet ministers. We are part of the decision making process. You might as well complain that you pay tax to the UK government but do not have a personal involvement in how every penny is spent.

Day6 just the other week the Express reported on a poll about overseas aid Give Overseas Aid to the NHS and social care

The poll asked: “Do you think you would be in support of Britain scrapping some of its overseas foreign aid commitments so that the money was instead diverted to the NHS, adult services and social care?”

The results showed 84% of respondents said 'Yes'.

As part of an ongoing campaign the Express also set up a petition last Autumn campaigning for Overseas Aid to be given to the NHS. It states 90,000 readers signed, plus 20,000 signed an online petition set up by Tory Party member and twice unsuccessful Tory parliamentary candidate Robert John Fairbank Barnes (it currently has over 26,000 signatures and closes 14th March).

Give Overseas Aid to the NHS

Yes, we are a compassionate country, but many would rather aid for those less fortunate overseas instead of campaigning for more funding for the NHS and social care from the government.

Given we're talking about 0.7% of UK national income, I find this very sad.

The so called 'unknown bureaucrats' are known to our representatives in Europe, e.g. Mr Farage. MEPs are there to represent us. We voted for them.

Yes, good post MOnica. And the benefits of that aid within the EU are being seen in economic growth in those countries...