Winnie Mandela

The fight against apartheid was a war - not just an ideological political struggle but a war against one of the greatest evil regimes in modern times. Tell me of a war in which those people on the right side of history did not commit acts that were wrong - the Spanish Civil War, World War 11 including the French Resistance - there is not one of us not one of us who can even begin to imagine what her early life as a wife and mother were like, the years of exile and the pain and suffering and humiliation she underwent. I’m not condoning some of what she did that was wrong but we in the UK have blood on our hands so far as SA is concerned - we should hang our heads in shame at how we supported and condoned that evil regime and when we’ve atoned for that, maybe, just maybe we might be in a position to start to be a little critical of WM. I ask again, what were her critics on here doing to combat apartheid? If the answer is nothing, then you have no right at all to sit in judgement on her.

'Dispite the beating, harassment and subsequent imprisonment, she had remained resolute in her quest to free the nation from the shackles of apartheid .

She refused to be bowed by the imprisoment of her husband , the perpetual harassment of her family by security forces , detentions, bannings and banishment .

Her courageous defiance was deeply inspirational to me , and to generations of activists.

Desmond Tutu

"High horse" "blood on our hands" etc. I've seen no one here supporting either apartheid or the brutality of the SA white government and its police forces.
I expect many of us campaigned against apartheid, refused to buy SA goods and demonstrated, contacted MP's, supported the struggle and so on. Please don't lump us with the Thatcher regime.
Yes, it's important to look at Winnie Mandela's actions in the context of the time. That doesn't mean she also doesn't have blood on her hands.

Historical context must be given priority when you give your thought to events. Without this context it is meaningless.

SA has long suffered from violence, from the first ever concentration camps where thousands of women and children died at the hands of the British, to the annexation of the land owned by the indigenous folk, to the suppression through violence and poverty of these folk to the present day, where poverty together with all the type of violence associated with poverty still exists.

You need to walk a mile in someone’s shoes before you give anything remotely like an informed opinion.

Why does Winnie Mandela make me think of Lady Macbeth?

Lady Macbeth was haunted by her past. I can't quote her exactly but it was along the lines of 'not all the seas of this land or all the perfumes in Arabia can wash this blood from my hands'.

I agree whitewave without personal experience we are not in a position to give an informed opinion, but we are entitled to have one and express it whether that be admiration for Winnie Mandela or not.

No I meant without historical context we can’t give an informed opinion.

We can all give an opinion. That is easy.

Lady Macbeth was haunted by her past. I can't quote her exactly but it was along the lines of 'not all the seas of this land or all the perfumes in Arabia can wash this blood from my hands

That was the blood of King Duncan whom she had murdered.
I believe Winnie Mandela also had much blood on her hands and would venture to suggest that was one reason Nelson Mandela distanced himself from her and her political history and guilty “henchmen” when he was released from prison, becoming a respected political leader.

Winnie Mandela was a bad un.
When Nelson M found out her true colours he divorced her.
The country is well rid of her.

Smileless2012
Oh how I agree.
You're absolutely spot on.

Right or wrong, I wish I had a fraction of her courage. We can all judge from the safety of our situation but she lived every moment of it.

Rest in Peace Winnie.

So Mandela was oblivious whilst in prison to what was happening in the country.

Anyone who wears gold jewellery including wedding bands bought in the sixties, seventies, eighties and nineties have blood on their hands, unless they were unaware of the fight against apartheid.

I admire Winnie Mandela for her courage and determination in standing up to the very brutal and morally bankrupt apartheid regime and its bully boys.

It is perfectly possible to praise a person for some of the things he or she has done whilst regretting less admirable behaviour. Unfortunately, violence begets violence and terror is often met with terror, but surely it is not right to airbrush it out of a person's history?

Having said that, I disassociate myself from remarks such as "WM was a bad un" and "the country is well rid of her" and comments comparing her with Lady Macbeth. Black people were fighting for their lives in South Africa and, in a very unequal battle where the police and security forces held all the cards, it is not surprising that sometimes people crossed the line.

Lol...well my hands are clean as I have never worn or bought jewellery not even an engagement or wedding ring, although I was married.
I don't like the feeling of things on my fingers, round my neck or in my ears.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

Eleothan, a fair post. Winnie said their hate taught her to hate. The police even took her wedding photographs from her and burned them when they ransacked her home .

The hate spouted here for a woman who suffered so much is unbelievable.

Really Gabrielle? It freed S,A. of apartheid. What would you have done if you saw police urinating on a child? Turned your back on her and remained so noble . What would you do if the police marched into your home and took your children from you? remained noble? If you were put in solitary confinement for speaking out against your husbands life imprisonment, remained noble?

There is no doubt she was a great support to Nelson Mandela when he was in prison and helped end the awful regime in South Africa, however, the use of violence against her own people who disagreed with her politics is what she will mostly be remembered for.

I think Mandela himself was implicated in violence earlier in his life? We excused him for that and he went on to become a great and benevolent leader

ReadyMeals ... the point is, that Winnie Mandela did it the other way round.

I just feel sick reading some of the things she is accused of doing, literally.

I'm with Anniebach on this one.

Oldwoman, what do you mean violence against her own people who didn't agree with her politics? You believe some black South Africans didn't want an end to apartheid .

Annie I feel there is no getting away from the fact that she was responsible for some very unpleasant acts, including this (from USA Today)

"In 2003, she was sentenced to four years in prison on dozens of counts of theft and bank fraud. A judge ruled that she profited from loans to poor people who could not get them without a letter from her. "

It is, of course, appropriate to praise her as well, but it shouldn't be an unadulterated whitewash IMO.

Anniebach you must be aware of the violent clashes between the ANC and other leading South African political parties, for example the Inkatha Freedom Party. I imagine that is what oldwoman means. Nothing to do with wanting or not wanting an end to apartheid, much to do with "you, the people, will vote ANC - or else". Currently the clashes that erupt are generally between the ANC and the Economic Freedom Fighters, the third largest party in the SA Parliament. Post-Apartheid ANC does not like critics ...