Am I alone in feeling bewildered?

Unfortunately it pulls at peoples heart strings and it feels like a battle against all odds. The little man standing up against the giants .
Look at how long the Stephen Lawerence case lasted.
We all like to champion a good cause.

Sheilasue it’s not if their baby dies it is when

Menopaws I respect you and your family. {flowers}

It’s a very difficult situation, and for one I would not like to be in that place.
It must be heartbreaking for them. What can you say, we,don’t know enough about the case really to make a comment. I know Dr.Hilary said on good morning Britain this morning that the chemical in his brain is probably helping the little one to breath but who knows how long that will last. Very sad looking at his father is heartbreaking they will need a lot of help if there baby dies. I wonder how Charlie Gards parents are now.

There is no better way to describe people like that other than to say they they're idiots. The child was managing to breath on his own when the life support was switched off but for how long that will go on for is anyone's guess if it hasn't already stopped. So rest in peace little one.

Menopaws . Thank you for your brave and achingly honest post.

Menopaws

I respect your post so much.

Menopaws, another echo of what others have said. The behaviour of many of those in so called Alfie's Army has been appalling. Causing distress and disruption at a children's hospital is disgusting. Reports this morning indicate the medical team involved have been on the receiving end of threats.

Menopaws I echo what others have said - a very brave and enlightening post.

Meno The parents of little Alfie need people just like you to speak to them and not all the pro life/ anarchist type trouble makers they have at present.
All the people quietly getting on with hard and heartbreaking at times lives.

Thank you Menopaws.
What this courageous father (and of course, mother, who has been quieter) need is quiet words from someone like you. That is not what he is getting from other people with their own agenda.

Being childless perhaps I shouldn't be posting on this thread but I do admire the father for doing all he can for his child.

However, I do not admire the crowds outside the hospital. Asking those inside to do everything to cause disruption is ignoring the needs of the other patients there, if they want to stand outside peacefully then that is fine but shouting, attempting to storm the building and intimidating staff achieves nothing. These protesters will not have detailed information about Alfie's condition yet feel able to try to intimidate caring medical professionals who would have thought long and hard before making the heartbreaking decision to switch off the machines.

Menopaws kind thoughts to you and your family

Brave, brave post Menopaws

My grandson is peg fed, cannot speak or walk and never will, laughs and smiles and understands everything and signs and adores his little sister.
He is handsome and loving and does as well as he can at special school.
His parents have amazed us in their care for him.
However he is getting bigger and needs the house adapted and filled with equipment soon.
He cannot be entertained with any one thing for more than a few seconds and is very demanding for attention.
If he cannot make his wants understood he has massive head banging tantrums, striking out etc which can only be stopped by physical restraint, he is strong top half although weak bottom half. My son is pretty much the only one who can do this. He has taken on full childcare as his wife is able to earn well but means long days in the city to make it work.
Without restraining the tantrum he stops breathing and needs resuscitating by parents or carers or the called ambulance men, who have permission to call it if he doesn't breathe for over nine minutes (he has reached 8).
Is this the life I want for my son and family. Not really.
Is this the life I want for my grandson. Def no.
Has this taught all of us something about life. God yes
Am I grateful for that. God yes.
Would I change anything. I don't know
Do I wish he had died a baby. Honestly yes
Am I glad to have him and know him and love him. 1000% yes.
One night or one day he will not restart, it is not always tantrum related, he has been known to stop mid a happy meal time.
He was never on life support so we never had to turn anything off but as others have so rightly said, cuddling a sick baby is actually lovely, dealing with a bigger child/man is quite another.
Our chap isn't suffering as such and people worldwide have much much bigger issues than us but let the doctors make their decisions and let this lad at Alder Hey go peacefully out of the bloody media because as big and clever as it sounds to want them to live whatever it isn't much fun.

I'm sure there must be people there who have a genuine belief that the child should be given a chance to survive, but there are also people who just like to jump on bandwagons and shout loudly, without having a great deal of insight into what exactly is happening. They remind me of the sort of mobs that turn up outside courts. It is disgusting that, in cases such as these, doctors and nurses - the people who are dealing with very sad and difficult cases day in and day out - have to endure the insults and threats hurled at them by some of these people.

My understanding is that it is the doctors' opinion that the child has a degenerative neurological condition and is already profoundly disabled. In my view, it was right to remove life support because if a child or adult cannot function without being artificially ventilated then they are not really alive. However, at the moment the child is breathing on his own and I think it is right that he be given water and any other support to prevent pain and discomfort - and I'm not sure if efforts should be made to feed him. It is very difficult for people who have no medical background to know what is the kindest and right thing to do. On the other hand, as paddyann says, doctors aren't infallible.

I do have a great deal of sympathy for the parents and agree with paddyann that the boy's father, who is only 21, should not be judged for pulling out all the stops to do what he believes is right but, as Day6 said, I wonder whether he has though about what sort of a life this little boy would have even if he were to survive - and how that would impact upon him and his partner, their future relationship and any children they may have. From what I have read, the little boy would have to be fed intravenously, would be unable to communicate, might not have a swallow reflex, etc, etc. It's not the sort of life I'd want for myself or for anyone close to me.

Like all in here my heart breaks for the parents of this terminally ill child. I do however feel nothing but disgust for the demonstrators outside who are intimidating staff and the families of other children being treated there. One wonder how many of them would be around to help the family if by some miracle Alfie survived. Feeding a baby and changing its nappy is one thing, doing the same for a massive 25 year old is quite another. I mean no disrespect to anyone dealing with a similar situation, it just makes me so angry to hear and read the ignorant and slanderous comments.

My DGS was there for minor surgery yesterday and while he was under general anaesthetic, those people were online asking anyone already inside the hospital to set off the fire alarms to cause maximum disruption. (This was after they had blocked all the roads and the police had sealed the hospital doors temporarily). I was worried about what would happen to DGS in that situation and was also very conscious of the noise of the demonstrators which must be so distressing to the parents of other children admitted to Alder Hey. Poor Alfie needs some peace too, my heart breaks for him.

The Judge won’t agree the child can go to Italy. He’s asked the parents and the medical team to talk to see if it’s possible for the little boy to go to a hospice or home

This little boy's death is inevitable. Medical reports shows that three quarters of the white matter in his brain has been destroyed and has been replaced by spinal fluid and water. The pathways in his brain responsible for all six senses have been destroyed, including those responsible for being awake and responsive.

There is absolutely no chance that his brain can regenerate and he can recover any of what he has lost - and the degeneration continues. The doctors rightly say that further treatment is futile. Better by far to take away the artificial means of keeping him alive and let him gently die.

He's doing what HE thinks should be done and he has to come to terms with the reality in his own time .Dont be too judgemental about him he's barely out of childhood and is doing his best for his family.I'd hate to be in his shoes.When my daughter was dying there was no way we would have questioned the doctors ..because we were too naive to think doctors could ever be wrong.Sometimes I wish I had stood up to them and asked more question instead of blindly accepting what they said.Maybe then I wouldn't have felt that it was my fault she died ...of course now 40 odd years later I understand it wasn't my fault.It took a long time to come to terms with it though .

All this whiles his child is sick and with no experience

And because many pro-life groups support his keeping his desparately disabled/sick child alive. Why do you think the Pope got involved?

I can understand the father not wanting to give up on his child, but really - is he thinking of what is best for his son? The cause and protest should not become more important than his son's right to die peacefully if Doctors have agreed there is no more to be done for him.

The father has achieved a great deal, particularly when you consider how young he is, but I wonder how much thought he has given to the future. Suppose this little boy does survive and lives for years severely disabled? A helpless baby is one thing, a helpless middle aged man is something else, especially if you think about the lack of help for families in these situations.

The demonstrators don't appear to realise that in any case of serious illness hospitals do speak to other hospitals, both here and abroad, to discuss treatment options. They are not in the business of holding patients prisoner, they would far rather co operate with others on finding a cure. The sight of hordes of people trying to storm the hospital is just disgusting. Don't they realise that there are other families with seriously ill children who must be having an appalling time.

I don't expect any of us needed to read the facebook post in order to have insight into the 'parents fight'.
It's rare for the state to be asked to intervene, in the shape of a High Court Family Judge, when parents and the medical team caring for their child can't agree. The Children Act places the child at the heart of these rare and distressing disputes.

It's quality of life, not quantity, and tragically this little boy has, and never will have any quality of life. For his sake his parents need to let him go, and those demonstrators who clearly haven't a clue what they're talking about, need to 'go home' and leave the hospital full of other sick children and their sometimes frantically worried parents, in peace!