Boris Johnson's Latest 'Gaff'

I don’t think the the English in France expect as much from the French as the immigrants do here.
Not most of them of course. (Immigrants, I mean) The vast majority interact with society very well.
No free french lessons for instance. No translators when in hospital.
They also don’t use all encompassing clothing which says, to me, I am separate, don’t talk or interact with me.

But British supermarkets don't sell those huge tubs of Nesquik do they?
Full of sugar probably!

I did know someone who used to go on holiday to Tenerife and fill their suitcase with bacon, sausages, bread etc. Why!!

Jalima you may well ask :
"Do they not have supermarkets in France? confused Why would anyone do that - half the fun of being in another country is shopping locally!"
'Carrefour baked beans/ bacon /pork sausages etc aren't as good as Heinz/Tescos '
Although there could be resentment in some parts of France towards british immigrants, it's on a much smaller scale so irrelevant to the subject.

sorry that should read * unable*

I was trying to say, I don't think the English in France is a comparable situation to for example Pakistanis living in Leeds.

The history is very different. The culture , language and colour is very different.

ESOL classes have been drastically cut especially for beginners. So sometimes people find themselves being able to start a college course because they have not got past the basics.
Web sites can help to some extent.

How do you expect someone from Bangladesh, for instance- where they use a very different alphabet and sounds- to use websites. Where my last school was, the Bangladeshis came from Silhet, and spoke a dialect - and none of the parents could read and write.

Where my previous schools were, many ofthe Asian children came from Uganda, and had very erudite parents, who could read and write several languages, and whose English was fluent in all skills.

If anyone is interested in learning English as a foreign language, then there are some free websites, eg:
esol.britishcouncil.org/

My Mother’s generation used to use the term colonies, so much older people still do I suppose ( GNers are sometimes 90 or older.)

oldbatty said "In the UK, the people doing the taking over often come from the colonies. ESOL classes are cut right back, so fewer opportunities to learn."

Firstly, who uses the term "colonies" any more! Second, most of those coming from "colonies" already speak English.

Good point Oldwoman

There are vans travelling back and forth every week to deliver food to the Dordogne ordered on-line from Tescos too.
Do they not have supermarkets in France? Why would anyone do that - half the fun of being in another country is shopping locally!

In the UK, the people doing the taking over often come from the colonies. ESOL classes are cut right back, so fewer opportunities to learn.

You're not wrong Oldwoman70.

jura said "When you live in an area which has been taken over by very large numbers of people who speak another language and make little effort to learn (I know there are notable exception- OH being one) - and cafés, restaurants, shops, markets, etc, provide more for the newcomers than for the locals, the language spoken is foreign..."

Isn't this exactly what is happening in some areas of the UK yet if people mention it they are called racist

The French village of Eymet ( nicknamed 'little England')
Has a different view.
Phillip Barb, a cheese maker in the village said: ^ if the English expats leave, we're screwed^

I don't think it wrong to question why certain things reoccur in some demographics, or religions for that matter. My mother an avid Catholic found it hard to come to terms with the historical level of abuse in the church, a church that meant so much to her. Abuse conducted so covertly that she and others like her would never have known it existed. Nevertheless, exist it does when we read of late that there were 300 priests involved in sexual abuse in Pennsylvania alone That's a hell of a lot for one state!

Similarly when the numerous cases come to light, of sexual grooming, mainly carried out by one ethnicity again and again, like the abuses by priests, it's not unnatural to think is this ever going to end, and is it still going on? It's not unreasonable to contemplate that when such abuses occur on an industrial scale, possibly there is something wrong with the culture that the abusers are immersed in. Whether it's trying to sweep wrong doings under the carpet as has been the way of the Catholic church or denying the grooming of young women, children even, by gangs is criminal and only highlights the deep injustice metered out to those victims who suffer twice. Not unnaturally, people really, really hate cover ups in the name of political correctness and this will be a factor used against certain communities, in spite of all those brave Muslims who have the guts to condemn the abuse.

Similarly, when there is an atrocious terrorist campaign that kills and maims umpteen, I think people get sick of the likes of Cameron (in particular) and their meaningless never ending platitudes along the lines of "this is nothing to do with Islam" when clearly it is, or indeed a version of it. It's tantamount to saying The Inquisition was nothing to do with Catholicism.

When discussing Islamophobia which exists throughout Europe, it's nonsensical to omit some of the mitigating factors that play into that. I think it occurs to a lot us, when we read how random some of the worst atrocities are, that could be us, or our nearest and dearest and no we can't all stand together, another platitude, if we are blown of the face of the earth by some of our fellow citizens !

And as in parts of EU, do not allow ritual slaughter, kosher or halal- without pre electrical stunning- which does NOT go against the Koran, as the animal is alive, even is electrically stunned.

Totally agree petra- for another thread perhaps?

Re above, the point being that many British people complain about the lack of integration os some groups- and then go on to do exactly the same elsewhere - which is hypocritical in the extreme.

I am with Rachel Johnson- ban the burka and chador, and be totally tolerant about modest dress, including long clothing, long sleeves, high necks and scarves- as long as not covering the face and prohibiting communication with others. Clear - simple.

Many of the local grocers and artisans suffer greatly from the white vans deliveries- many have had to close or cut down prices massively to just keep above water.

jalima, good point. I live in a part of the world which is strongly Reformed- and there are lots of Churches for expats too, btw.

Chewbacca 'Do the Brits living in Dordogneshire and the Costas create cultural, social and religious divisions with their Tesco delivery trucks?'

cultural and social for sure. When you live in an area which has been taken over by very large numbers of people who speak another language and make little effort to learn (I know there are notable exception- OH being one) - and cafés, restaurants, shops, markets, etc, provide more for the newcomers than for the locals, the language spoken is foreign... and even worse, the food, building materials, white goods and labour- arrives in white vans with foreing people working for cheaper rates and paying no taxes- yes it does create real frictions and more. As for clothing- I am sure many locals would prefer modest dress rather than shorts and string vests with overhanging bellies and moobs ;- even BoJo looks well turned out in comparison. LOL.

lots and lots of comments about BJs comments but not one about the very dangerous sermon that the immam of Didsbury mosque gave, where in the congregation that day was the killer of 22 innocent people at Manchester Arena.

Perhaps they want to take communion, jura, which a Protestant cannot do in a RC church.

Interestingly Rachel Johnson has apologised for her brother, saying he didn't go far enough, as she would ban the wearing of the burka here.

She mentioned several reasons why, which have already been covered on this thread.

Sunday lunch at the Johnson family home anyone?!!

They have their own Churches too

Shocking! (Not the going to church , but failure toseek out a Protestant church in their village)
When DH lived in Paris the family went to the Embassy church.
Catholics of course went to Mass in a French church.

I don't think anyone is complaining about anyone not "speaking our language" though are they? The main problem, which is what this thread is about, seems to be about the wearing of a garment that inhibits social interaction between people.

Do the Brits living in Dordogneshire and the Costas create cultural, social and religious divisions with their Tesco delivery trucks? And who listens to, or believes, a single word that Farage says these days?

Thank you Joelsnan that had passed me by (did wonder if it was a result of autocorrect! )