The Last Days of Mrs May?

I am perfectly well aware of parliamentary process Grandad, and have no need of your explanation. However, since you stated that the Labour Party are not responsible for the debacle, and I simply agreed with you that they are indeed not in any way responsible, I fail to see why you imagined I either wanted or needed a lesson from yourself, on parliamentary process.

maddyone, the Labour party are the parliamentary opposition. It is their responsibility to hold this government to account on the policies they bring forward. May & Co have not indicated that they wish to see a cross-party coalition government formed or even requested any Labour party plans for Brexit be tabled for debate in the House of Commons.

Therefore, until a General Election is called or a further Referendum is announced the Labour party can have no effective bearing on the parliamentary and national chaos this Tory Government has caused.

It is also the job of any opposition party to bring about a general election so that its core beliefs can be placed before the Country. Should that election come about then all can question those policies, but until then all is the responsibility of this shambles of a Tory Government and no other body.

They’re not in any way responsible Grandad, they just haven’t got anything better, or even worse, to offer.

It was Cameron trying to silence the Eurosceptics in the Tory party that brought forward the Referendum. It is now very clear those same Tory Eurosceptics had no idea on how to bring about Britain making an orderly withdraw from the EU when that Referendum was won by those same Brexitiers.

Those Tory Brexitiers then engaged in a two-year demand of leaving terms from the European Union that under the terms of the treaties that Britain had signed ensured the European Union were unable to grant those terms. The Tory party then engaged in an internal battle that has brought about the parliamentary chaos the country now sees in front of it.

Now, would some forum member please point out to me how Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour party can be held in any way responsible for the above debacle.

Welshwife I also watched Margaret Becket's speech and was very impressed by her clear insight into the state we are in and her indictment of TM for her bad handling of the whole brexit fiasco.

It was a nonsense for TM to start off with these ludicrous "red lines" which have resulting in the present "deal" being the best we could ever expect from the negotiations.

Corbyn may think he could get a better deal, and so do some Tories, but the stark choice is between TM's bad deal, (far worse than the good deal we now enjoy), a catastrophic no-deal and what TM describes as "no brexit" - the best deal of all.

The opposition have been next to useless and haven’t got any real solutions to the current crisis. They are all paddling down sh1tcreek together.

Au contraire, they *have played a role!
They voted along with the Conservatives that the referendum would be implemented and then voted to trigger article 50.
Since then, they have vacillated, argued with each other and
Suggested different methods and strategies to leave the EU.
Latterly they have abandoned any pretence of doing what is right for the UK by going all out to get another general election in spite of this upheaval being the worst thing the country needs in the middle of this mess.

Apologies should be role not roll above.

It seems to be very often overlooked by many on these threads that it is the Tory party in the role of the current government that has got the United Kindom into this huge mess.

The Labour party have played no roll in the above and therefore have no obligation to cooperate or in any way assist May & Co out of the current situation they have got their party and this nation into.

Therefore, the accusing figure pointing should be fully on the Conservative party as they are 100% responsible for the current national debacle.

I want to scream [and often do] when I hear the words 'the British public have voted to leave the EU'. For a start it should be 'England and Wales have...

theres a song for this isn't there "clowns to the left of us jokers to the right " certainly fits Tory and Labour .
All the sensible speakers were late at night welshwife when the house was nearly empty .Tories and labour wont listen to SENSE .

Margaret Beckett made a very good speech in Parliament late last night - I watched it today on You Tube. I found it by searching on Twitter and following a link.

Not exciting, worrying it seems as if there will be an attempt to get better terms and 21st January is I'm the date for that to be debated, presumably as soon as MPs return after Christmas parties.

So TM will continue, if the EU will reconsider, will MPs accept that Deal - unlikely because JC wants an election, if he wins, the deal offered still stands and he probably has to share power with SNP so still no majority for anything.

If TM looses a vote of no confidence a new Tory leader will be elected and any GE will be late Feb or early March

Or maybe MPs will vote to end Brexit, impossible to call.

Oh. I think it's rather exciting.

You are right grandad.it scares me.

Undoubtedly what Britain witnessed yesterday (4/12/18) was the complete disintegration of the Conservative party. The sight on the late evening news of Boris Johnson speaking in the agreement debate while two other conservative MPs sitting on the bench directly behind him were "poking faces" at him and gesturing was beyond belief.

Those pictures demonstrated to the whole country the depths of the rift in the Tory party to the extent that it now cannot be viewed as having any central ideas on Brexit that the electorate can in any way look to.

We now seem to be moving in "uncharted political waters" with Theresa May in Government but not in power even within her own party, while the country faces the biggest crisis it has faced since the second world war.

Dark days indeed.

Again it's been admitted on NW News that this area has had the least government funding compared to the South. This really is disgusting ! We've always been the poor relations of this country so is it any wonder that 3/4 of the population vote Labour ? Where else are there 3,000 children without proper homes over this Christmas ? This is an utter disgrace.

It's only been the EU that has lifted this part of the country from falling down the mire as neither a Labour nor a Conservative government have assisted the NW yet we pay our dues just like everyone else.
I, like many, really question any reason to vote for anyone when we're not recognised as being part of the country as over the years and especially of late the division between North and South has got wider.

Most ( sensible) countries where they have a lot of referenda tend to make a proviso that there has to be a 60:40 majority for any major constitutional change, Cameron missed that chance ( among many other mistakes).

A majority of 1 is a majority

Would you say that Paddy if there was a vote in Scotland to leave the UK, and if the Nats won the day, because it was hard to implement, you would blithely say ‘cancel the whole mess, it was hardly a landslide in the first place’ .....No? Thought not, because it wouldn’t be democratic would it!

cancel the whole stupid mess,it was hardly a landslide win in the first place and should never have gone any further once the "victory" was seen to be such a tight margin.Just walk away ,forget it happened and move on from there .

Exactly Smileless a lot of hot air from MP’s who say they don’t like the deal and not one has any alternative plan!
Both twerps Corbyn and Johnson were spouting nonsense today in Parliament.

Yes as a Labour Party member I have been very disappointed by Corbyn fence sitting over Brexit, but you are right varian that there is a consensus amongst most members of the LP to Remain in the EU. Probably not as split as the Tories in that respect.

I am right about Corbyn, he refused to take part in any tv debate during the campaign , he even went on holiday

You may well be right about Corbyn, that although he said he supported Remain, his support was so lukewarm that he might well have been a closet Leaver.

However, if that is what he still thinks, he is totally at odds wioth the Labour Party as the majority of Labour MPs, the majority of Labour Party members and the majority of Labour Party voters want to Remain in the EU.