Should ageism be considered a hate crime?

I'm just not very happy with using the word 'hate' to describe a category of crime. It's not a word that should be used lightly. there is too much encouragement of extreme speech, emotions and views these days*. The only alternative that comes to mind could be 'Disrespect' which I think covers the intention without being extreme. Others may agree or disagree.

To be honest, GrowingOldDisgracefully, I wouldn't describe what happened to your father as 'hate'. It seems to me more like ignorance and casual disregard of the feelings of others. In my mind 'disrespect' covers it better than 'hate'.

*with regard to encouragement of extremism I found this article to be interesting (and a bit frightening);

Time and again, researchers have discovered that when videos with political or ideological content are uploaded to the platform, YouTube’s “recommender” algorithm will direct viewers to more extremist content after they have watched the first one. Given that most people probably have the autoplay feature left on by default, that means that watching YouTube videos often leads people to extremist sites.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/23/how-youtube-takes-you-to-extremes-when-it-comes-to-major-news-events?CMP=share_btn_tw

I don't think it just applies to 'major news events' either.

I haven't read through much of this thread but would say, as in so many cases it all depends upon YOUR definition of the subject.
It seems now that people are considered by the law to have been racially abused if they consider it to be the case. This may, or may not be my view , as a by-stander , on the situation
Even worse is the situation where people may now self-define their gender, no matter what their physical attributes.... hence a male rapist, self proclaiming as a woman, being put into jail with born women.
I may, as an 80 year old take offence at someone of a younger age who shows me scant respect. I have seen the struggle my offspring have to suppost their families and carry out all necessary duties in a time of increasing pressure. Maybe that person whom I deem to have offended me is struggling to survive. There are many possibilities for interpretation. Let's be careful.

I agree Maisie. Older people may be discriminated against, but that is not the same as being part of a group that is hated simply for being what they are. To say that they are, devalues the meaning of the word.
I don’t believe that that sort of hatred towards older people exists in this country -yet- but it may well do if older people start to portray themselves as victims.
I was reading an article yesterday in the Economist about how attitudes in America towards women have changed since the #MeToo campaign started a year ago.
More people now believe there are false accusations against men and more people believe men should not lose their jobs because of previous sexual assault/harassment.
There differences of course, but the differences were not on gender lines but on the political divide - perhaps unsurprisingly, attitudes had hardened far more among Trump voters than among Democrats.

I too am uncomfortable with all the -isms we have to deal with.

Could we perhaps go back to calling some of the incidents you all mention here sheer bad and disrespectful behaviour and try to bring up the youngsters we are in contact with to respect all age groups, both sexes (plus those in the middle) all skin tones etc. etc.

I am really uncertain about whether more laws defining inconsiderate or downright rude behaviour as a hate crime will have any other effect than slowing down the work of the police and the law courts.

No, not a hate crime. It should continue to be flagged up as unacceptable, and people should continue to be educated about it as such, along with the other “isms”, but in itself I don’t think it should be described as a hate crime. Like many things, it’s perpetration is down to ignorance and prejudice and it is this that needs to be dealt with through education and discussion. If other crimes happen as a result of ageism then they should be treated as such and dealt with appropriately.

No, not hate crime.

Let’s not make ourselves yet another set of victims relying on the state.

Instead we should use our experience to help others while leaving our police free to fight crimes of theivery and violence.

It certainly should as all the Old Age charities tell us of the terrible way some very vulnerable elderly are treated these days. More often than got by people they should be trusting.

There are horror stories of elderly ladies being sexually attacked by older men just because they are vulnerable. These men hope old women won't report them but they are encouraged to do that now. It is shocking. Make it a crime and it will stop!

There are scams to get the elderly to hand over their money and I am not talking about the usual telephone scams. These crooks work within some charities and groups that are supposed to help the elderly get work done on their homes. Charging then three or four times more than they should and all "above board" because they are supposed to be working for a charity. The police know them and want the power to arrest these criminals for committing a crime. Hundreds of thousands of pounds is stolen this way every year. It often kills the victim, it is such a massive shock.

Then there are carers who steal as a "perk of the job". A real human would never do that, they would think of the shock on the victim when they discover money or property missing after trusting someone in their lives. Hurting them physically or threatening them with a beating or worse to hand over money should also be a crime

Anything that entails dehumanising anyone vulnerable to exploit them for gain or sex have to own a hateful heart. It can devastate a life and often leads to an early death.

I can't imagine anyone not wanting this to be a crime the police can use to prosecute. It's time we put a stop on these monsters and spell it out clearly they will no longer get away by targeting the vulnerable of any age

Can you imagine a 90 year old woman sexually assaulted by a 60 year old man and the police unable to call it a crime? An elderly couple threatened by abandonment and neglect by a family member to hand over their banking details and later find their home has been sold without their knowing? It's happening every day.

I don't know what the BBC is on about..
In what way are they saying that ageism could be construed as a hate crime?

How very sad and a terrible indictment of modern life. If something done to an elderly (or any other) person is a crime then it should be dealt with by the authorities. If it is rudeness and disrespect I don't think there are enough police to deal with it.

And people being pushed out of a job in which they are very experienced and highly knowledgeable because they are expensive (and nowhere near retirement age) and the job can be done badly by someone much cheaper- that is a form of bullying.

What's next to jump on the band wagon? Somebody is always looking for the next, sometimes trivial, issue and important causes then get forgotten.

I'd say no, it should not be a hate crime - the police are already stretched pretty thinly and struggle to solve all the real crimes without hurt feelings being considered criminal! If an older person is a victim of crime then it should be dealt with by the police and courts like all crimes - the justice system was not designed to be overfilled by people claiming their feelings were hurt/ignored or they were 'offended'. Real hate crimes are nasty undertones in our societies - we do not need made-up 'crimes'. Maybe look at stiffer penalties for those who offend against the most vulnerable, including the elderly. Naming and shaming might work to stop some re-offending, but these days some people don't seem to have a sense of shame about their wrongdoing and even take pride in their criminal activities! Respect seems to have somewhat diminished in recent decades and attitudes stink in some circles, but that's life. A world slowly filling with generations that have different values, a lack of respect, where selfishness and personal desires rule, a strange sense of entitlement is developing and instant gratification is expected. Back to basics using common sense and context - make the justice system more robust and punishments that fit the crime. Verbal insults, disappointment, being told 'no' etc might not be very nice but are not necessarily criminal and non-crimes should not be upgraded to hate crimes. Genuine victims of hate crime need the full protection of the law and support from society - current legislation could be enforced more effectively.

endre Can you imagine a 90 year old woman sexually assaulted by a 60 year old man and the police unable to call it a crime
Sexual assault is a crime. The police would always treat it as a crime.
It is just not a ‘hate crime’ in the way that for example, desecrating graves because they belonged to Jewish families would be.

A crime is an unlawful act that includes physical aggression. A 'hate' crime means that an unlawful act was driven by a strong dislike (aka 'hate') towards a person's gender, lifestyle, race, age (as in this case), ethnic background or religion.

Example: An older citizen is badly beaten on the street for no apparent reason since nothing was taken, not even his wallet. The perpetrator is also known for shouting that older people are "useless" and "shouldn't even be allowed to go outside." These comments are indicative of a very strong dislike for the elderly. The subsequent beating of the older citizen by the same person who also made these comments, can be categorized as a 'hate' crime.

No. Any crime is just that - an act intended to damage someone else. The sentencing of the criminal should reflect the type of crime they choose to commit.

We cannot keep giving the police more and more "labels" to cover. We are (most of us) appalled at crimes against anyone just because of their colour, looks, mental capacity, age, religion etc etc, but they are all just crimes against our society. Stop complicating things unnecessarily.

No of course not
Abuse is a crime already, rape is a crime already it doesn’t matter whether it’s an old or young person its still a crime

I don’t consider your Dad nearly getting knocked over by a running child who was rude to him as a hate crime growingoldisgracefully That was a naughty and rude kid

We are not needing any more hate crime titles certainly not on my behalf Please stop and let the police deal with real criminals whatever age the victim is

wildswan,

I agree with you that the sentencing of a crime should fit the gravity of it. Sentencing based on the crime itself without taking into account the motive however, could result in a lighter sentence. Without motive, there is no way to measure the crime.

In order to establish a legal standard to describe crimes driven by prejudice (aka hate) they have to be labeled as such. Otherwise they can't be prosecuted fully and the sentence would reflect that. I believe that's where labels are useful.

If you had to punish someone for breaking a store window to steal bread, it would be useful to know if it was hunger or because the thief acted out of negative feelings against the baker himself. The latter would make the crime more serious. Motive is everything.

I absolutely agree. That comment about your dad not mattering any more was unacceptable. I have also found that people increasingly seem to consider it okay to speak disrespectfully about older people since all this talk about how we are to blame for all the woes of the younger generation.

Not another one for Heavens sake. I am old but definately dont feel old and I am never treated as really old, I am still young at heart and treated as such. We certainly dont need any more hate crimes let the Police do their job and try to catch real criminals.

I think we would all like the police to pursue such crimes as burglary, assault, robbery, fraud and murder and are a little upset that they fail do do so in many cases today. Creating yet another special case for hate crime is unnecessary because the crimes are already on the statute book and there is no guarantee that, identified, they would pursue an ageist offence any more rigorously than they pursue crimes now.

Blimey are they looking for elderly snowflakes now?!

I think that deliberately breaking a window is criminal damage and the police should be allocated the resources for investigating such crimes which already have a label without adding more to their work overload.

I was listening the radio today whilst driving and apparently there are calls for misandry to be included as a hate crime.

No more isms, please. Before long we'll hardly dare to open our mouths in case we commit an ism.