So no hope from Jeremy either?

Honestly, does anyone- leaver, remainer, Tory, Corbynite, or not, green. blue or spotted -

actually believe he 'forgot'?

Well if he forgot to remember- he is not fit to be Leader, and retire asap.

He didn't forget of course- he agreed with his colleagues- and then sneakily and very deliberately took it out. Traitor so not fit to be Leader- against the Party will.

Jura he forgot to remember !

He fears a second referendum, remain would win I think , and he wants out, what sort of leader went on holiday and refused to take part in tv debates during the campaign.

So let me get this right. JC wrote a letter to Mrs May, put together and agreed with his Senior Colleagues. And then he 'forgot' to put in the bit about a second Referendum. Just forgot?!?

So either he deliberately cut it out without agreeing to this with his senior colleagues- and he is a traitor, pure and simple.

Or he 'forgot' a key point at a massively important turning point, at the last minute. In which case he has serious memory issues, bordering on onset dementia- and is not fit to be in charge of LP.

Which is it?

POGS it felt like screaming as it was repeated so often.
Baroness Warsi had made many statements and cited cases of anti Islamic attitudes in the Tory party. Easy to find on- line. I was not saying anything that was not already in the public domain & people might have been aware of.

Jura

I have to say your post on another thread is a classic.

jura2 Fri 08-Feb-19 12:34:15

" Digging for facts and truths is always good."

PECS Wed 06-Feb-19 21:40:35

"POGS rather than just screaming 'prove it' all the time why not disprove it with your evidence?! That would then prove that your opinion might be based on evidence. It is a 2 way street!"
----
I am asking a poster who made a statement for evidence not by ' screaming ' !

I cannot ' prove ' that posters ' statement ' to be true or false as you request as I have not seen evidence either way but it is incumbent on posters to back up their ' statements ' with facts/evidence or it is a lie/misinformation/political spin.

I am well aware , who isnot well aware , anti - semitism , islamophobia and racism are evident in the UK and Worldwide but that was not what was stated is it.

jura

" 'Islamophobia is rife in the Tory Party, and in some sections of the Labour Party too - but it is never talked about."

The conversation had ended to a degree because no evidence was forwarded by the poster but you PECS carried it on so I answered your personal post to myself.

Great posts, thanks.

In our community of close friends we have people of different faiths and none and of different ethnicities. What we all have in common is a strong desire to for justice and peace.

My AC and DGC have friends with a similar mix of backgrounds... even in our small Surrey town. The more we get to know and love people different to ourselves the more we can see our commonality. It is, in my opinion, beholden on any host community to make newcomers welcome and comfortable..as most of us would do to guests to our home. By treating people with the respect and courtesies we would give to our 'indigenous' neighbours we reduce the 'otherness' which allows racism and abuse to thrive.

So do I Fennel. I'm in a former mill town where we have a large community of Pakistani Muslim origins. They came by invitation in the 1950's to work in the cotton mills. No mills now of course. We have an established Polish, Hungarian community that has increased in recent years. A small Afro Caribbean community and as with everywhere, many families of Irish/Catholic origin. we have a growing community of asylum seekers/refugees from African countries.

So far, so good, we have completely missed the race riots many former cotton towns experienced. Maybe that's because we haven't had huge pressures on housing and there are (limited) opportunities for employment.

Like Fennel, I hope and pray we can continue to live together in peace. We do see children from all the communities walking home from school together.

Good posts, PECS and Iam
I'm a Jew, (convert) living on the fringes of an orthodox jewish community.
Just around the corner are many immigrants from muslim ME countries. Mostly Turks (I think)
There are many mosques and synagogues, also christian churches, within half a mile of our house.
I hope and pray we can live together in peace.

Jewish people and communities have been targeted for as long as we have verbal or written history. The bigotry around anti semitism is so well established that people use casual comments like 'jews are all rich' "jews like money" without even considering that's an anti semitic comment often times, I've heard it said casually, almost in admiration. the notion of a poverty stricken Jew is beyond many people. North Manchester has always been home to a large Jewish community. At the turn of the last century, the Jews and the Irish lived along side each other. Two poverty stricken communities that helped each other out. Angel Meadow was home to both, there is verbal and written record that the Irish would keep the fires burning on Sabath so their Jewish neighbours could eat hot food without breaking the laws of the Sabath.
We live in dangerous times when all manner of bigotry and prejudice seems to be on the increase. That jura is why these issues are relevant to the OP, Brexit and Jeremy Corbyn. Brexit has let loose some prejudices that had been squashed. Some would say they were squashed because so called political correctness meant some were afraid to speak out.

Lemongrove I believe I did say that my Jewish friends had been subject to abuse. I am not a,denier of anti Semitism. I just do not see it as worse than other forms of racist/ religious discrimination.

Jewish communities existed , as a minority, all across Europe and Nth Africa for 1000s of years. When times are good and food plentiful nobody notices. When times are hard: famine etc. people blame the minority for causing the problems. Anti- Semitism has been endemic for a long time and it waxes and wanes depending on the economic climate.But it is always there. Now there are other minority communities they too are targeted as the cause of lack of homes, wealth , jobs etc. It is rarely if ever true but the people in minority communities take the flack.

Oh absolutely agree. Especially in rural areas whipped up by the dreaded and dreadful UDC/SDP.

What has this got to do with Jeremy Corbyn, Brexit and the OP?

Unfortunately, perceived Islamophobia is not confined to parts of the UK, nor its press

www.academia.edu/37430948/Antimuslim_Racism_Islamophobia_in_Switzerland

I had no idea which country you were talking about tbh,
But Switz seemed the more likely.
Gaza has nothing to do with UK Jewish people.
Not fashionable to care about Jewish feelings, though these days is it?

No group should be abused. What I have said, is that looking at front pages of the tabloid Press, and in my own personal experience- Islamophobia is much more prevalent in the UK than anti-semitism.

And you know very well I am talking about Gazza- and not Toblerone land. Will drop right out of this discussion- no point at all in continuing.

No comment about Jewish people being subject to abuse then?

......and one should think before tarring all with the same brush!

Toblerone Land?

So if it is not fair - should one not think before tarring all with same brush. Be they Catholic Priests and nun abusing kids, the mass graves found in Ireland, the IRA and more.

As for 'here' many of us look at the situation beyond just 'here' - and you know already where I am talking about.

PECS of course it’s not fair, but it’s what happens when extreme acts of violence by groups occurr.
Muslims will, by some, be tarred with the same brush.
Yes I expect some Irish Catholics did get abuse too at the time because if the actions of the IRA.
The peaceful Jewish community in the UK also get plentiful abuse from some, and they have no extremist groups committing outrages here.

So what is the excuse for Polish people [in fact anyone speaking with what appears to be a foreign language] being verbally abused more than before the referendum?

Fundamentalists of whatever faith tend to give others of that faith a negative persona whether they be Catholic, Protestant,Muslim Jewish, whatever. This tends to be an unfortunate fact of life. Why Jews are a target is a mystery as they do keep a very low profile.