Corbyn's true colours revealed - "Defeat' the EU!"

Sept Conference 2018:

Labour delegates have approved a motion that would keep all options - including a fresh referendum - on the table if MPs are deadlocked over Brexit.

It was passed by a show of hands at the party conference in Liverpool.

The vast majority were in favour of the motion, with only a small number against.

Leader Jeremy Corbyn - who has previously ruled out another EU referendum - has said he will respect the result of the vote.

Sir Keir Starmer said earlier that the option of staying in the EU would be on the ballot paper in any future referendum if Labour gets its way.

In his party conference speech, the shadow Brexit secretary said all options should be kept on the table, including a so-called People's Vote, to "stop a destructive Tory Brexit".

Now that is clear - clear as a bell. And Corbyn is NOT respecting it.

yep - what about this 'Conference decision' then?

Labour MP Chris Williams on Politics Live states the Labour Party does not want a 2nd Referendum.

He is a Corbyn stalwart and he makes the differential between the ' wider ' Labour voters and the ' Labour Membership ' and how the Labour heartlands are needed to win a General Election. Something glaringly obvious and has been spoken of on copious amounts of threads.

The Corbyn faction of Labour is at odds with Labour Membership over the 2nd Referendum and Corbyn is delaying the calls for a 2 and Referendum because it suits his Eurosceptism.

Ben Bradshaw has just made the point very well in the HoC - they will be BOTH judged very harshly- BOTH.

He has forgotten the next position

Grandad

You used to tell posters off for changing the topic now all you do is resist answering points about Corbyn by speaking of Theresa May. Your posts used to be slightly higher in debate content .

You can repeat the mantra. ' Jeremy Corbyn has remained loyal to the Brexit policy set out by the Labour party conference' till you are blue in the face but at what point does Corbyn go past stage 1 which was ' get a General Election' ?.

You and Corbyn can hold to the principle of going for a General Election for ever and a day but at some stage he will have to agree to moving towards the next position as agreed by the Members at the Labour Party Conference surely.

Well said Jura

But I don’t see Mrs May as flip flopping, she voted remain, the referendum result was leave and as PM she has accepted the result

It is not a flip-flopping competiton Grandad - yes May is the champion, for sure.

But we are here talking about Corbyn. He could show leadership, he could come out clearly, he could listen to his party and MP, he could do his job- oppose- He hasn't. In discussions with his supporters fairly recently they kept saying 'oh don't worry, he won't let it happen, he is playing the long game but will intervene just in time' and on and on. Oh and he will be able to find a middle way (you know the cake and eat version- with unicorns on top) just in time.

And now they say 'ooops too late'- we will have to let it happen - take the country down with it, the economy, the jobs - then Corbyn will take over asap and do miracles for the country, you'll see.

And, NO, I don't see it. 10s of 1000s of jobs will be lost in the poorest areas- the £ tank, the financial services industry moved out of the country ...where will the money come from for those miracles?!?

Imagine a parent beating the kids badly - and the other parent just close his/her eyes and does not take every step to stop it - who is then responsible. And I say, the one who does the beating - but the other very close behind.

POGS, if you wish to refer to politicians "flip-flopping", then Theresa May must be the most primary in that. After all, she was for remain during the referendum campaign but changed to leave to obtain the Prime Ministers position.

So, we have a person who really believes that Britain should remain within the European Union leading the negotiations for Britain to leave the European Union. In that, it is little wonder that those negotiations are in such a state.

The words "Flip-Flopping" certainly do not do justice to the above. Other words come to mind such as, double standards and two-faced naivety, but there, that's what anyone would expect from those who hold office in this Tory government.

Grandad

"POGS, as I have stated several times it does not matter what Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour party do or not do, as they are not the government at this time of great crisis."

Yes you have stated several times Labour are not in government and therefore not accountable. I find that an incredible opinion to hold but if you think being in opposition means you are somehow weak then who am I to argue.

A). The OP is not referring to that point though is it? The OP is pointing out his hypocrisy .

B) If Corbyn/Labour are so insignificant as an opposition then why should the electorate bother taking any notice of what he/they say.?

C). Corbyn has either done a total flip - flop over his Eurosceptism or Corbyn is as many have said been misleading his supporters, I do think the penny is finally dropping for some.

D). Is Corbyn following the Labour line ? Corbyn is only abiding by the principle of trying to get a General Election by fair means or foul and not giving way to anything else. Why are so many grass root Labour Members so disappointed he is indeed continuing to sit on the fence?

E). If Corbyn/Labour are as you repeatedly say not in government so not accountable if a Snap General Election were held what would Corbyn's /Labour policy be? The last Labour Manifesto has been shown to be nothing short of a lie so why should the voter take any notice of Manifestos/Policies from Labour or any party that doesn't believe in enacting their own Manifesto?.

jura2 Quote [it's called effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition ] End Quote

jura2, no matter how good the "effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition" is, it would still not produce a majority in the House of Commons to defeat this government as long as the DUP remain as it's cohorts.

Therefore Corbyn cannot prevent anything that this shambles of a government wishes to do.

Everything in this Brexit crisis has been brought about by the Tory party and no other body.

It is as simple as that.

POGS, as I have stated several times it does not matter what Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour party do or not do, as they are not the government at this time of great crisis.

However, what Theresa May and the Tory party does effects every one of us, and they have through their incompetence in the leave negotiations taken this nation down a pathway that should never have been necessary.

It is not Corbyn that's been on a journey, but all of us, and we still do not know how that journey will end.

Not good many seem to feel.

it's called effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition

quite simpla, put country before party and personal ambition. And also face the obvious- that he won't be eledted ... come what may (pun not intended).

Grandad

Are you are trying to tell us the old twaddle that gets trotted out when a politician does a screaming u turn, looses his/her conviction ??

' Corbyn ' has been on a journey '.

jura2, I still cannot see how any person who is not part of this government or the DUP can prevent the administration carrying out any policy that it wishes.

I have- several times.

jura2 Quote [ as you say, same old, same old.

And the result will be - No Deal. And he could stop it. And as such, I will make him responsible, as well.] End Quote

jura2, regarding your above post, please inform me how Jeremy Corbyn could "could stop a no deal Brexit" in view of the fact that he is not in any way part of this government ????

as you say, same old, same old.

And the result will be - No Deal. And he could stop it. And as such, I will make him responsible, as well.

jura2, I seem to recall that Jeremy Corbyn brought about a vote "of no confidence" in this government only two weeks ago. However, the Tory party along with their DUP cronies voted down that motion for no other reason than self-preservation

As most political analysts agreed, that was the only occasion when such a no-confidence motion had any chance of success; I cannot feel that Corbyn could have acted differently prior to that vote.

Corbyn has remained aligned to the conference policy on Brexit and the grassroots of the movement criticised him when he moved away from that.

However, Theresa May has totaly rejected his move, so the position is now as previous to his letter to her.

Therfore, it is once again that this crisis is entirely in the hands of this shambles of a government, and as it was entirely of their making all criticism should be directed towards those numpties that make up this government and nowhere else.

No rôle in bringing it about- but aiding and abetting all the way to disaster.

A recall of conference policy would, I am absolutely sure, be very different. But Conference did say there would be a Peoples' Vote if a vote of no confidence did not lead to a GE.

This is what LP members have said all along- don't worry, he is playing the long game, he will stop it - and now say 'ooops oh dear, too late'.

Apologies should be "policy" above not "pol"

jura2, the circumstances surrounding Brexit have not changed, but the time frame has. Therefore the circumstances that formed the basis of the Labour party conference pol has remained the same, and I believe if there were to be a recall conference the policy would remain the same.

However, while some on this forum seem to try to lay this whole Brexit debacle at the door of Jeremy Corbyn, he has, in reality, played no part, for he is not the Prime Minister and the Labour Party are not the party of government.

It is the Tories that are the party of government and solely and totaly responsible for the crisis this nation now faces.

As stated Coryn and the Labour party have played absolutely no role in bringing that about.

and we will never, ever have the same favourable terms- better than anyone's, we have got now. Germany +++

oh grandad

'Jeremy Corbyn has not sat on the fence in this Brexit crisis; he has remained aligned to the Brexit policy set out by the Labour party conference which was drawn up by the twelve thousand voting delegates that attended that conference.'

circumstances have changed - lies have happened, fraud, and so much more. And now we all know about it, and we also know leaving with No deal will be a disaster, and cause massive problems with the UK/Irish border.

So yes, this Government is to blame- yes, this Government is an absolute and total shambles....

the majority of Labour party members have realised now- and so many MPs and seniro colleagues too. Corbyn could embrace that and explain why, it is not possible or good to go ahead. But he won't.

He wants Brexit, he wants it to turn out to be a disaster and to bring Mrs May down - so that there will be a GE. In the meantime, the country will go down the pan, the economy will go down the pan we will become vassals of WTO, Trump and so many more- and even then - he won't win.

Jeremy Corbyn has not sat on the fence in this Brexit crisis; he has remained aligned to the Brexit policy set out by the Labour party conference which was drawn up by the twelve thousand voting delegates that attended that conference. In that, Corbyn has received criticism even though he has been carrying out his role as the leader of the parliamentary party to fulfil the laid out directives of the party Conference being it is the highest policy-making body in the Labour movement.

However, Corbyn last weekend moved towards this shambles of a government in an attempt to form some agreement that will stop Britain "crashing out" of Europe without a deal. That done, What does Corbyn receive for that move, criticism from within his own party for moving away from the Conference policy.

Further to the above, Theresa May then rejects his move out of hand to appease the Tory party rabid right wing, even though the European Union Negotiators advised they felt there was much in Corbyns letter that would make a basis for further discussion.

However, it matters little what happens in the Labour party, as they are not the party of government, for that accolade is held by a division ridden Tory party.

In the above, that government is made up of a Conservative party where the above-mentioned divisions in the party have taken this nation to the very edge of economic disaster. Today (13/02/18) the Ford Motor Corporation have stated that if Britain should leave the EU without a customs union, then it will have to consider the future of all its assembly plants in the UK.

The above should be thought on in conjunction with the thirty major food manufacturers and distributors who earlier this week wrote to the government stating bluntly that they cannot continue production and distribution as normal while in the grip of all the uncertainty over Brexit. Those companies need to gain certainty for forward planning, processing and ordering even from outside the EU. In that, what do they witness, Theresa May again kicking the can down the road while trying to keep the rabid right of the Tory party quiet.

Party before country. Self-interest before national interest. What a "bunch of Bozos" this Tory party is.