Britain 'risks heading to US levels of inequality'

Inequality of health care is another inequality we are rapidly moving towards Maizie. Indeed we are already seeing the outcomes of this. However, it is such a big subject so worth concentrating on elsewhere.

sodapop

Rather than copy and paste it to here (and derailing this thread even further as it is not about the NHS) I'll refer you to my post of 15.31 on this thread:

www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1261299-Our-NHS-is-being-privatised?pg=2

It's the will to invest that is lacking, not the money.

Thinking about it I correct myself?

Northern Ireland

Another case in point. More religious perversion.

At least we trust women in the U.K. will be subject to what Alabama is intending to impose on its women.

Father can now be grandfather, in a heartbeat.

Ghastly religious perversion

So would you be happy if it were to become like the American system sodapop?

Yes we should be grateful for our NHS but our ever increasing expectations of the service are putting it at risk.
We cannot continue to have a world class service without more investment, this is not the only problem I know but it looms large.

I would guess that, both from the standard of living you perceive as one you could not manage on - and yes, I do appreciate that you are working after state pension age because of that belief -and the fact that you believe the benefits system is not yet tough enough, you know little or nothing either about the poverty many now live in, or the benefits system twice as nice

I have worked hard all my life. At nearly 66 I am still working part time. I really enjoy my job and intend to continue as long as I can. However it goes a long way to supplementing my state and 2 tiny private pensions which would not be enough to pay for everything if I didn’t work. Not luxuries but everyday bills. So not sure what will happen when I eventually can’t work any more.

I feel the benefit system is flawed ( never claimed) I think people who are genuinely unable to work should be paid enough for the to have a decent lifestyle but it should be made harder to claim for people who could work but choose not to. I don’t know what the answer is but the one thing we should all be grateful for is the NHS

Thanks for clarifying annep1. I think the NHS was nibbled at for quite a few years and then chunks were bitten out of it. I have never been able to see how you can have the National Health Service and profit directly from it.

Cherrytree59 - those of us who live in the EU have S1s which prove to our host country that the UK government will pay for our health care.

In France the majority pay into a mutuel which is a top up insurance. Whenever we need medical treatment the state pays a proportion and we pay a smaller proportion which is covered by the mutuel. Should we get a life threatening illness the state pays for everything, once there is a diagnosis. The system works quite well and appointments for referrals are generally much quicker than in the UK. The other difference is that the GPs aren't time restricted - ie appointments will last for as long as is necessary - no restrictions to 6 minutes or whatever the allocated time is now in the UK.

I have collected several American friends on Facebook and have been struck by the way some of them are working two or three jobs to just about manage. It doesn't seem like a great place to live. And of course there is always serious illness - I've spoken to people who have been denied tests they needed because their insurance company decided they weren't necessary, I've spoken to people who haven't been able to go to the consultant they wanted because their insurance wouldn't pay for that particular hospital, and I've even spoken to people who have gone on to risky clinical trials because that way they don't have to pay for all their blood tests!

A doctor friend of DD spent a few months in a hospital in New York. She said that over here a man having a heart attack who needed three stents put in would have it done in one operation. Over there they would do three separate operations so that they got paid three times!

GG.... Let them eat cake...?

Gracesgran... I was replying to this comment.
In the U.K. whatever your income, you know that you will get good quality world class health care.

I don't think it's as good as Whitemark believes it is. Good when you get it. I've had to pay a lot of money twice privately because of long waiting times and have joined a private scheme. I can't go conpletely private. Others can. This isn't equality. What have I said that isn't clear? (Maybe I'm not explaining myself well. I'm not very good with words)

I am a bit fed up with the 'lets sneer at America'.
'
Oh we dont want to be like the Americans.

Our ...... (fill in the blank) is so much better or

'Not more Americanisms'

My uncle emigrated to the USA in the 1960s as did many others.
He worked in a factory and he and my aunt put both their children (boy and girl) through their education system and College (university).

My one cousin is a history professor and his children are both
in professional careers,

My other cousin works for a big bank.

When the ship-yards were closing my uncle got on his 'bike' took a chance in the US.
They were made welcome but were told that if they wanted to get on they would have to work hard.

The wage were/are better than the UK but they do have much less holidays than the UK

My aunt and uncle paid into the health care system (factory wages).
My aunt sadly was struck down with breast cancer in tbe 1980's.
Their health care paid for all her treatment, my Grandparents offered but they had adiquate cover.

My cousins partner has thankfully survived breast cancer and was able to use her health insurance.

We may well agree that Trump is not the best president that the USA has had since independence, but for all its faults (show me a country that hasn't any )
America is still a land of opportunity.

I love our NHS and have on a number of occasions have been very grateful to it.
However there are many GNers living overseas who manage quite well by paying into that countries health care system.

www.insidernj.com/press-release/tully-swain-timberlake-bill-protect-information-federal-employees-affected-partial-government-shutdown-approved-assembly-panel/

It's a brief article pertaining to one facet of what can rapidly happen to individuals and families when faced with sudden financial crisis -- and what one state is taking the initiative to do about it -

Too me, the Bill is an admittance that the government isn't doing its "job" -

3 months savings won't save a person long term- Meaning, even those living within their means aren't protected from financial crisis - The only people protected are the top 1% -

I think all countries are faced with becoming like each other due to globalization -

Gabriella, your "story" about CEO and leaders .. I imagine I could find myself "comfortable" too with "your" description of what they do .. Hahahaha ..

But that would be too flat-earthy of an idea for me to buy into -- although not the lifestyle, admittedly ..

Could I pretend that there was no global financial crisis of 2007 - 2008 ... ? Or course!

GabriellaG54 That's why people should always save some of their earnings (a recommended guide is 3 months salary) to tide them over rough patches such as the one experienced by the man in your comment
Can you explain exactly how someone does that on a low wage when there is just enough to meet your outgoings, and when if a big bill comes in you have to 'borrow' the rent or food money to pay it?

"A doctor should sort out the pain issues" You really don't have any insight into where you lack knowledge, do you Gabriella? Just being dictatorial does not make things happen. Lily had the good grace to admit, as we all should, that there is knowledge we don't have and understanding we have not yet gained. Just opening yourself up to those thoughts would do you no harm in the humanity stakes.

Of course people with literacy problem or disabilities are able to work.

Can you see how issues are interlinked? No money, no bus fares, no transport . Literacy problems, can't read forms, panics, forms pile up. Low mood, eats poorly, more low mood. Depressed, isolates himself, gives up and so on?

I don't believe in a world of givers and takers.

Well said Greta. To think that democracy was all about one vote on one day misses the point. Sadly the problems often lie with those in the middle who do not seem to understand how it might be to live others lives - or how easy it is to end up in that position. I've no idea why some can and some can't but it is that group who are often most influential when it comes to either understanding or ignoring the democracy of fairness, equality and of whether, on a day-to-day basis, you feel you have a voice or not.

Lily65
Not everyone who has literacy problems is unable to work.
Not everyone who is disabled is unable to work.
A doctor should sort out the pain issues and a referral to hospital would diagnose the knee problem which could then be addressed.
A visit (with a doctors letter saying why he had to give up his employment and what is happening as regards his knee) to the job centre to apply for benefits including housing and council tax should have been next.
I hope the man followed those procedures and got the help he needed but there are always givers and takers.
You have highlighted one.
I'm possibly much more cynical than you.
That's why people should always save some of their earnings (a recommended guide is 3 months salary) to tide them over rough patches such as the one experienced by the man in your comment.

I volunteered at a food bank in a poor area. I am not saying this because I think I'm anything special or because I am virtue signalling. I was becoming isolated and needed to get out.

I'm ashamed to say, I had been indoctrinated to some extent to expect scroungers and freeloaders. The people I met were certainly not these things. One very tiny example, a man who had developed knee problems and so couldn't carry on with his physically demanding job. He was in a lot of pain, and had some literacy problems. A relationship had broken down and he had fallen behind with the rent. Have you ever been to a job centre? It's the most demoralising and complicated system. His self esteem was shattered, he was in pain, depressed and in debt. Then follows poor diet, poor choices and so on. Very close to calling it a day.
Have people no compassion, no understanding.?

I'm approaching a Full House

Since the referendum we have talked a lot about democracy. We seem to have a very narrow definition of that word. It means more than implementing the wishes of the party/group that won an election/referendum etc. Democracy also relates to equality and fairness but we don't often hear that. I have always found the obsession with wealth in this country obscene. It seems wealth is so important we need to publish a Rich List every year. If we seriously believe that the gap between rich and poor is too great we need to do something about it.

GracesGranMK3
You don't say what you mean by 'your fair share of the country's wealth'. If you work and make money, that is completely fair and it's totally up to the individual as to how they spend or save the money they earn...after tax, of course.
My ex paid no tax on his salary in Dubai when a resident but, after moving to Ireland for 6 months of the year, he then paid the appropriate tax on worldwide earnings.