Horrified by Alabama Abortion law

Thanks varian. I must have missed your post I think.

Gosh Id forgotten about the Overton Window idea, but it definitely fits with what is happening in western democracies just now. I will have to wean myself off this thread because I'm finding the situation so depressing - but just read of a ray of light for some women in abortion hostile States. There is a apparently a charity called Aid Access, which provides online access for abortion pills, which was founded by Rebecca Gomperts last year. They have been warned that they are violating federal law by selling the drugs, but the founder of the charity has said they will continue operations. Even in states where women can access an abortion, poorer women cannot afford it as it can be prohibitively expensive.

Very true janeainsworth. The Overton Window theory goes a long way to explaining how what was utterly beyond the pale can gradually become acceptable. This happens without a general awareness of the seismic shift and is extremely dangerous, especially now malign on-line influences can high-jack our democracy.

www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1250287-The-Overton-Window?pg=2

Yes ..

Especially over a "law" that isn't really legal yet and may never be (hopefully not, anyhow).
Let’s hope so starlady.

However, it seems to me that there is something more subtle and dangerous going on, as well as the control & oppression of women.
It is that when ideas which many people consider unacceptable are repeatedly expressed, they gradually become less unacceptable. As this happens, politicians are then able to bring more and more extreme policies to the table, as we are seeing now. The Overton window explains it.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window
Of course it is not just happening in America. In Britain and the rest of Europe, far right views which would never have been aired 20 years ago are becoming acceptable to more and more people.

'They protest by way of digging their heels in firmly and fighting the ignorance instead of moving their families to other states where abortion bills aren't being signed ..'

I imagine it would be hard for many people to just up and move their families to another state, anyhow. Especially over a "law" that isn't really legal yet and may never be (hopefully not, anyhow).

Day6 The Governor of Alabama is a woman.
Look at her Wikipedia entry to see all the other awful things she has passed into law since assuming office.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kay_Ivey

Rosecarmel I’ve recently spent a couple of months in Alabama and agree with you about the people there. We were met with nothing but friendliness and kindness.

rosecarmel

Absolutely sure of that. I really hope the American people can overturn this dreadful ideology.

I feel it important to add to the discussion, the states in which these bills are landing are truly beautiful, as are the citizens that live there -- mostly ..

They protest by way of digging their heels in firmly and fighting the ignorance instead of moving their families to other states where abortion bills aren't being signed ..

Actually ILoveCheese the twins were an easier birth than my first single.

Wierd I know

And ditto Day6 it’s utterly dreadful

Day6 - so wish Gransnet had a 'like' button!

There are 28 pages of discussion so just adding my dismay and anger that men (mainly men decided this?) in Alabama can make laws denying a woman's right to make decisions about her own body.

It's a retrograde step, fuelled by religious fervour no doubt.

So very wrong. If women all over the USA aren't protesting, they should be.

But "late abortions" is a misleading term as they do not occur late in pregnancy, they only happen up till about half way! They are just later than most. But still nowhere near late pregnancy!

Mycat Twinns! No wonder you wanted an epidural!

Mycatisahacker Apology cheerfully accepted, it was just the word nonsense that annoyed me.

I so want to be pro choice. I consider myself pro choice! However, I find the thought of late abortions abhorrent. I am so glad that they are a rarity. I do think that after a certain point you need to suck it up. Just not wanting a baby at that point isn't good enough. Adoption maybe. Unless your life is in danger or the baby (I do condsider it a baby at that point) will have no quality of life are what I would consider 'special' circumstances. And I am talking about late abortions here only. 18-20 weeks plus. And yes - absolutely better access to birth control and education.

Iam it was earlier your post The majority behave responsibly and obey laws. Let’s not assume everyone is a potential criminal or will abandon parental responsibilities. I just wondered if that would continue to be the case if abortion was banned with the resultant rise in unwanted pregnancies.

ilovecheese

Sorry just seem your post I do apologise. It was mainly tongue in cheek as in my case I asked for an epidural for all my births the last twins and apparently the anaesthetist was ‘busy’ in theatre each time.

Bugger! Of course women should choose the birth they want.

SirChenjin, not sure what I said that makes you believe I think men will behave responsibly etc. My experience sadly, is that many men don't behave responsibly. I do acknowledge that many posters have sons who have been treated badly by female partners. There are so many of us though who have ourselves, our daughters, our friends, women e've worked with (endless list) - have direct experience of men behaving irresponsibly.

I read something very worrying in Saturday's Guardian. Apparently the Trump administration has cut off funding to any overseas organisation or clinic that will not agree to a complete ban on discussing abortion. the US have extended the gag stating that any organisations counselling women on abortion using funds from elsewhere........even a donor in another country will no longer be eligible for any US funding. The diktat applies to all global health organisations, HIV and children's charities must sign the pledge, as well as those running sexual and reproductive health clinics It's worth reading the whole article by Guardian's health editor, which is truly shocking, that this ruling from the US can have such far reaching and dire consequences for women's health overseas.

mycatisahacker I know this is a bit off topic but what makes you say " all this nonsense about natural childbirth (ie this excruciating pain is fine for you to endure for hours) would just not exist."

If you mean that men are denying pain relief for women during childbirth then that would be very wrong, but does that actually happen?

Childbirth without medical intervention is perfectly possible, it is not "nonsense", but again, it should be up to the woman concerned to make those choices.

Blacktabby2 I am so sorry you went through that, it was not your choice.

Starlady, the Trump administration is currently in the process of overhauling the courts, appointing as many conservative (Republican) judges and justices as possible in advance of the 2020 election-

Trump claims to be Pro-Life all the way but insists exceptions should be made-

But his claim that exceptions should be made could be a ploy, offered to gain votes- His stacking of the judicial system with conservatives could reflect his hidden agenda to overturn Roe v. Wade -- and also possibly subject the country to conservative decisions for the next 30 years-

Blacktabby

Many years ago...aged 17..l got pregnant. My parents were horrified. I had no choice. I was taken to a private hospital...no counselling before or after. That was it. I was made to stay in for a week as obviously l had murderer written on my forehead. I always wish that baby 'happy birthday 'on its due day...would have been 40yrs this year. How l wish l was stronger years ago and had run away. I will never forget....