Cry, our beloved country

Oh jura2 you seem to revel in your predictions. It seems famine and pestilence await us. Experts on the other side of your narrative disagree with you.

One of our AC is married to an EU citizen.......fill a form in on line- job done. Splitting families- absolute tosh!!!!!

Too late Eloethan! Terrifyingly possible isn't it.

Russell T Davies is a very imaginative script writer who has been responsible for some excellent fictional tv series.

No-one can predict the future with any certainty, only imagine scenarios of 'what may happen if'.

Some mixed couples have no idea what lies ahead, and if the family will be split up. Some people with terminal C or children, GCs with same, or rare diseases, do not know if they will get the treatment they will need. Many people in some industries and in agriculture have seen so many jobs go, and don't know if their job will be next. British expats dependent on EU permits and pensions in declining Sterling- do not know what is going to happen to them. Etc, etc, etc .... so you don''t see or understand people's REAL worries, which is why you find them ridiculous. Does not mean those concerns are not really genuine- just because you can't see them.

GG13

Day6 you said it all, so I don’t have to
Staring into the abyss ( really folks!) and foaming at the mouth during the day and sleepless at night....really ?!
The OTT ness that is social media just seems to overcome posters at times, the inflamed rhetoric, the nihilistic outlook, the sheer joy of moaning with righteous indignation at the imagined state of the UK......it’s ridiculous.

Eloethan Years and Years is written by Russell T Davis.......who wrote the new Dr.Who series. Time travel, Daleks, Cybermen etc?????? It’s not real!!!!

will Europe be as friendly to us as allies as they were in WW2?

I am failing to understand that question.

Perhaps your knowledge of history is different from mine, EllanVannin.

It's depressing isn't it. Whatever you do, don't watch the series Years and Years or you'll be frightened as well as depressed.

I notice 52% considered themselves "haves" and 48% "have nots".

Day6, I agree, there is no need for concern in regard to the Britains present situation as nothing has yet structurally changed for the UK in regard to its international trading since that very divisive referendum. Thousands of trucks every day still cross the English Channel without delay, and those that have consignments on those vehicles need have no concern regarding tariffs that those consignments could become subject to outside of EU membership. In short, UK businesses trade with their European counterparts in exactly the same way as they have for the last forty years.

However, no one knows how those trading partnerships will fare should Britain leave the EU without a trading/customs agreement, and in that many businesses may find themselves having to trade under WTO rules and tariffs in which they have no experience whatsoever.

In the above workers in Britains vehicle production, food production and road transport industry (to name but three) have every reason to be very concerned in regard to their future employment. Further to that, those workers have lived under that threat for the last three years due to the incompetence of this Tory Government and the ideological divisions within that party.

However, many Brexit supporters demonstrate little or no concern for the future employment of so many and their families in the category of the above, caring only for some fanciful utopia that even the most ardent Brexetiers admit may take very many years to bring forward, if ever.

On social media and forums such as this many of those "leave fanatics" appear to be "retired armchair risk takers" who in reality have little at stake however badly Brexit impacts the UK.

In the above "I shall be alright Jack" seems to be the Brexitiers first prerogative, and to hell with everybody who will lose out badly due to Britain leaving the European Union.

So, in regard to Brexit, great justifiable concern for very many, while there is a great unjustifiable non-concern and selfishness in others.

Why would factions want to fan the flames of despair?

notspaghetti I think the problem now is that all the situations you list, and I remember everyone, took place within a country with a working government and a longstanding and stable political system.

Now it is the foundations that are slipping. You can have a derelict and damaged house, but on good foundations, and it can be rebuilt and refurbished, but if the foundations are unstable and it is sliding down the side of a hill then all you can do is demolish it. This is the problem, the foundations have gone and we cannot see anything in its stead.

We have seen failing nations over the years, they only cease to fail when they have a stable government system. In the meanwhile everything within the country collapses for years before that can happen.

The situation we are in is that both the great parties that have dominated our government for a century or more have declined to the level found in failing countries, fighting within themselves, they have leaders that are too weak and untrustworthy for anyone to have any confidence or reliance in them.

Nothing that is happening in either party indicates that either of them are prepared to admit how bad things are and how deep is the contempt for them felt by the general public.

That is the difference between then and now - and there is global warming.

Day6 your post is how I feel!!

I didn't say there was nothing to worry about Bluebelle.

My point is that certain factions (left wing/remainers) have a vested interest in fanning the flames of despair and helplessness.

My point is that most of us are going about our lives as usual. Some may be embroiled in online political discussion, but most aren't and most are not letting Brexit or any other political event cloud the day to day nature of our very ordinary lives.

All I am saying is I wonder if any one this particular discussion are going to sit and brood and feel utter despair because we may be leaving the EU when they switch off their device? Will they go to bed thinking about Boris Johnson? (Now that would be the stuff of nightmares!)

Some here seem to have an agenda. They would have us believe the horsemen of the apocalypse are galloping down the M1 as we type.

I do not dispute that the UK is in the middle of political turmoil but can we be perfectly honest about the way in which Westminster cock-ups impinge upon our day to day lives?

I am wasting valuable minutes of my life being here. Five years from now, if we are still alive, the same old posters will be foaming at the mouth about some other political mess. I'll be there too if a certain Marxist politician manages to get the keys to number ten!

I refuse to foam, that's all. If we could REALLY influence life and politics fair enough, but we can't.

We are all entitled to our opinions and world view. Mine does not involve believing the left wing propaganda that we will never recover from what we are going through now and that the people of these islands are embroiled in political discussion, or despair, or sadness, anger, or rage.

Like me, most people save those draining and extreme emotions for events which directly affect our own family circle.

That's it really. And I stand by it.

I never felt despair like this in the 60 s 70 s or 80s and the various strikes and bad world news, but yes now the country is completely divided and in a VERY dangerous position and anyone who denies this has their head firmly in the sand I can’t believe how anyone can miss it
I m glad you’re not worried Day6 but that doesn’t mean there is nothing to be worried about

You are getting this so wrong day6

You are letting your assumption that i am a left wing poster get in the way of making a rational argument about the findings by a company situated in Somerset House in London. They have carried out many of these sort of researches in the U.K. and in previous years they would have undoubtedly produced results that chimed with your world view.

You need to either provide evidence that contradicts their findings or otherwise your annoyance seems a lot of hot air.

Day6 - You are right that "life is about more than politics".
In the 1970s and early 80s we had the collapse of the mining industry- which devastated whole areas and communities and also threats of nuclear war. Some of us were anxious about this as we had young children and wanted them to have a future.
Then we had the Chernobyl disaster and were more worried for our families - and our world.
And NOW we may be causing the collapse of our world and some people "in power" (who don't believe in climate-change) just don't care...
So yes, it's certainly not just politics, but many decisions that affect us all in all sorts of ways are ultimately political.

Grandad1943 you are SO right that in a perceived crisis we can (and do) often pull together. But you are also right that it's better not to have the crisis in the first place!

I know I am not EllanVannin but it needs saying never the less, because some people on here have an agenda to promote despair, anger, helplessness.

It happens online in political forums like this one, and newspaper columns.

If I can't sleep at night because of worries, I can assure you they are not ones brought about by the shambles that is Westminster and our MPs.

The U.K. is a divided and unhappy country

It is not.

Online it may be, because it's a good place for the cut and thrust of political discussion.

At home people sigh in despair at another useless lot of politicians - but go about their daily lives as they always have done, and will continue to do.

Life has never been easy. Many of us have been besieged by difficulties, yet a sense of proportion and a two-fingered salute to the latest politician to annoy us, keeps us going, striving and looking for the best for our families, no matter what our circumstances.

Online keyboard warriors paint a picture of life that is nothing like the life that we are living right now, and hinges on politicians and policies.

Much as you'd like it to be bloody awful Whitewave most people not enjoying political discourse online, roll their eyes and accept that they can do nothing much but accept the status quo, no matter how bloody awful it is regarding our government, parliament and Westminster bureaucracy.

And it is a shambles right now. Most of us know that, but it is top of very few worry lists even though people like you (an on-line left winger) want us to feel helpless despair.

Life goes on. Always has.

You're not telling us something we don't already know Day6.

none have the total disgust and despair of the majority of the public beleiving that the whole system is failing with no one in political life anywhere near being capable of leading the country.

I agree with that M0nica - drain the Westminster swamp certainly stands.

I wonder however, if the incredible short-comings of most of our MPs/politicians and our inept two party system has been put into sharp focus because of social media discussions? We are all much more aware.

However, I do not think our present political predicament compares to the turmoil which hit us all during industrial disputes several decades ago.

Everyone has opinions of Corbyn, May, Johnson, Gove, Momentum, etc, etc, and they are voiced and broughtv into our homes via the internet.

I am happy to turn off my PC and get back to the lovely business of life, with all it's slings and arrows of misfortune and beautiful bits too. Our MPs are well paid to take the flak and make bad/or good decisions. Let us not forget they still eat in the best restaurants, travel first class and they can indeed switch off, afforded by the cushion of a good salary, good life and the promise of a damned good pension.

It is up to the individual to make the best of the bubble that is their life.

Life is about far more than politics - and it is short. A sense of proportion is needed for those determined to see the UK going to hell in a hand cart.

We tend to survive political upheaval. We have survived wars, and we hope our children and grandchildren will too. The future is not ours to see, and never has been.

Ranting online won't change anything. But it does make you wonder about people who seem to want to perpetrate an end of world scenario when things don't go their way (politically.)

It's interesting.

Oh dear day6 you couldn’t be more wrong. You are letting your leave credentials blinding you to everything. The report was about all parts of U.K. society and it is as much about leavers and remainers.

It is clear from yourposts you feel just the same as the result found by the report you are unhappy and angry at not yet having left the EU.

Others are angry and unhappy because we will be leaving the EU.

The U.K. is a divided and unhappy country.

"The rhetoric is filled with words like broken, sad, worried, and angry"

Well it has to be, as it's biased towards remaining in the EU.

Really - is it just remainers who peddle this angst about a broken country? Where do you have to go to witness this 'sadness', because as ever (and such is life,) most of us are ticking over just as we always have.

I suspect you have to be a very politically motivated person to imagine we are all torn, bitter, angry and wrecked. The newspapers and online columns and keyboard warriors might be keen to perpetrate the myth that all is lost and hopeless, because well, they cannot accept the result of the referendum, but y'kno, life goes on and people are NOT wrapped up in the doom and gloom scenario some love to go on about.

I have as big a social conscience as the next person and I agree with Gonegirl. I haven't noticed society fragmenting as Remainers would like. I suspect they lap up fellow Remainers telling them all is lost.

I DID feel much more anxiety, strangely, during the union/industrial disputes of the 70s and 80s. That was very real, mainly because the electricity ould go off at all times of night and day, factories were blockaded, wild-cat strikes were rife, bins weren't collected and bodies were piling up as funeral directors were on a go-slow, along with other workers involved in burying or cremating a corpse.

We had no social media then, peddling its bias and reports of us staring into an abyss.

We are not, and as always, this time too will be consigned to the history books and we will have something else to worry about in the future, that is not EU related or to do with May, Corbyn or Momentum.

It's called life, and it doesn't always run smoothly.

More people fear Corbyn and Momentum around here than anything else.