Can they have it both ways - BMA

Oh and I would have no objection to having to show my passport if it meant that I no longer had to wait up to a year to see a consultant

What I don’t understand is why the argument that it will cost the NHS in extra admin staff to check the paperwork a valid excuse not to do anything. Surely the money that would be generated from correctly charging people from overseas would more than meet the cost?
Think how much money the government has made from charging overseas students fees of at least £20,000 a year. I know because I used to work in an international office at a university and part of my responsibility was checking paperwork to confirm their fee status. We were trained to deal with any queries in a pleasant but firm manner. It can and needs to be done by admin staff.

It cost me a fortune too - even with insurance which doesn't cover everything.

I wish I'd thought of using the NHS for my knee replacements one of which was thoroughly botched by French surgeon. I chose a diiferent surgeon for the second. I didn't have good convalescent care either.
Mind you, even if I'd thought of it I wouldn't have morally considered it on the cards.

Callistemon I pay tax in UK and France where I live. The UK currently pays for my health care in France and I have a top up insurance. I feel a bit peeved at the suggestion ( not yours ) I am taking advantage of the NHS. I worked in UK for 40 years. Obviously health care is going to be a concern in the event of a hard Brexit.

As usual our system makes a song and dance about collecting payment for foreign nationals to be treated in our hospitals.
Why don't we do as they do in the US and take a credit card BEFORE treatment commences.
And no no no we shouldn't provide free treatment. The NHS is always telling us how stretched for funds it is and denying life saving medicines for various illnesses.
I'm sick of the uk being taken for a mug!

Thirty years ago we had a neighbour whose daughter was married to a Frenchman and lived if France.
She came over to have each of her children(3) on the Nhs.

She was not a pleasant woman and upset all the other neighbours during her 3 month stay.

She considered her 4 years working here prior to her marriage gave her the right to the Nhs.

It wouldn't work unless we all have ID cards.

A couple of years ago my son had a hospital appointment and as part of a pilot was asked to take ID to show he was resident in the UK and entitled to nhs treatment. Don't know if anything came from it. He has had many appointments since and has not been asked but maybe it's because they now have it on record.

It was a bit if a pain because I handed over the stuff (he has SN) and was told there was no photo ID - but the letter didn't say photo ID!!! I showed her the letter. The receptionist called to her manager and said "thats why no one is bringing any". In fact it gave no clues about what was acceptable so I'd taken a variety!!

I once had a Bulgarian carer who actually told me off for our stupid country giving everyone free medical care!
she said they come here now!!!

but if we are short of helping our own elderly people then it is crazy......you won't get free health care anywhere else in the world either.
It is obvious that if you were ill and could get on a cheap plane travel to get free health care then you would come here.
It can't be free to the whole world and stay.
I worry we will lose the NHS

vickymeldrew I saw that too and I am astonished to hear that this treatment has been taken away from you.
Apparently the treatment is not available in his home country of Bangladesh so he has been treated here. The doctor treating him said that it is not up to her to make the judgement; she is presented with a sick patient and treats them.

I should clarify - they have to pay UK tax on their pensions - apparently.

health tourists haven't paid into the NHS as we have, so they should not be able to use it
What puzzles me, though NanaSuzy (if I have understood this correctly) is that UK citizens living in some other countries have to pay tax on any pensions that come from this country (is that right?) but are not supposed to avail themselves of our NHS, which they are helping to pay for.
It doesn't seem fair.

Perhaps someone will correct me if I've got this wrong.

Newnanny are you confusing immigrants with visitors/tourists? Non EU migrants as part of their visa application have to pay an immigration health surcharge to access the NHS. This is £400 each per year of visa for applicant and family members.

123Coco, I don't usually get involved in spats on here, but really how very dare you, what an uninformed stereotypical comment you have made. So people get more right wing as they get older and old people are 'Leavers'. Nonsense.

It's simple economics, health tourists haven't paid into the NHS as we have, so they should not be able to use it. Try getting healthcare in most other countries without the wherewithal to pay. Doesn't happen.

Surely its not Drs who charge those with no entitlement, it's the Health Authority. Try getting medical care in USA, before anyone sees you tge admin are asking for health care details, not interested in health insurance company only credit card details. They see it as your responsibility to claim costs from insurance company, you have to pay. If long treatment they will contact insurance company for you to make them aware but that's it. We shoukd adopt a bit of their style.

* Non UK University students should take a loan from their own country not UK as they skip off and do not pay back loan to UK governmen*
Student grants and loans are are only available for students from outside the EU if they have lived here for three years or more. EU students can apply for grans & loans immediately.
Now, newnanny , before you start ranting again, why do you think international students come here to study? It's because we (currently) have the best universities, and also lots of companies eager to employ graduates. So the likelhood is that these people, once graduated, will be employed and paying taxes here, as well as paying back their student loans.

It may help the discussion if everyone had some facts at hand: fullfact.org/health/health-tourists-how-much-do-they-cost-and-who-pays/

Recently, there was a BBC programme on immigration -Who Should get to Stay ? One of the people featured was a Bangladeshi who has been here illegally for five years. He suffers from Crohn’s disease and claimed he would die if sent home as they do not have the facilities to treat him. His application to stay was accepted and he was shown in hospital having an infusion of his life-saving medicine. Until recently, I have been having the EXACT infusion he had to treat a chronic condition, but it has been taken away from me as there is a world wide shortage of it and it is very expensive. How should I feel ? Am I being self important and indignant coco ?

The fact is our NHS belongs to the UK people not the doctors and not those who are not UK citizens. If they want to access it they should pay upfront or have travel insurance.

Mareeiliz Very true.
I wonder on viewing the comments made by those who claim the UK' should' give out free NHS to the poorer countries and whose residents do travel to the UK in the knowledge 'they will not be turned away' if ill and will get treatment for free'
Do they or cannot they see the 'wood through the trees' and should be concerned that they themselves many no doubt having as UK residents paid into the NHS not see that they or their own families may be pushed further' back of the queue' for their own treatment.
The NHS does not have a 'bottomless pot' and would those that work for a living and there are many who just about scrape through want to see 'contributions' increase in the name of 'charity'.

Think the issue is that the medical staff, Drs, do not believe that they should be policing the payments. The government should set up some scheme whereas anyone visiting should have proof of insurance.

I am severely allergic to mushrooms in the same way some people are to peanuts. When in France I had an allergic reaction in a restaurant and had to have emergency care or I could have died. I had to pay upfront to get that adrenaline injection.

The UK is too soft on immigrants. Non UK citizens should pay for their own medical care up front or have medical insurance. Non UK University students should take a loan from their own country not UK as they skip off and do not pay back loan to UK government. Universities should not give out graduation certificate if students leave university owing for library books or accommodation.