Top Jobs in EU

The allies included Americans, British, Russians, Free French, The Jewish Brigades, Canadians, and many more. They all fought together to defeat Hitler and the Nazis. The important thing to recognise is that Europe had a very different history than Britain which seems to have made a difference to how the British feel about being ‘ruled.’ The borders constantly changed in Europe over the centuries, unlike Britain. The Europeans have been used to being ruled by a variety of rulers who frequently changed. Poland didn’t even exist until relatively recently. The way European laws are formulated is different, they made many laws in advance of necessity whereas Britain makes laws retrospectively to deal with problems as they arise. Britain has a Common Law system whereas Europe has a Civil Law system. These differences matter because they in part explain why the British have always been a square peg trying to fit into a round hole in the EU.

GreenGran78......so what!
We couldn’t expect it for nothing, and what we needed was help when we needed it, to fight the war.

maddyone

Thank you.

It is an interesting subject and the nomination of Ursula von der Leyen by the EU Council has certainly pitted the EU Parliament against it.

When you think the main Spitzenkandidat list was :-

European People’s Party – Manfred Weber

Party of European Socialists – Frans Timmermans

European Conservatives and Reformists – Jan Zahradil

Alliance of Liberals and Democrats for Europe – “Team Europe”

European Green Party – Ska Keller / Bas Eickhout

Party of the European Left – Violeta Tomič / Nico Cué

( Smaller groupings put forward their candidates but the above are the main players.)

When you know there was a T. V debate, votes taken, names registered and the person who was not included in any of them, Ursula von der Leyen, won, then it is blatantly obvious the EU Council has thwarted the warning by the EU Parliament not to abide by what the Parliament sees as a more democratic way of electing the President of the EU, rather than the shanannigans the EU Council have reverted to.

As for the USA, they didn’t enter WW2 until Pearl Harbour was bombed. That event brought them in. They had been asked to support before but had refused, except to sell us a lot of arms, which we were paying for until recently. Britain stood alone until 7th December 1941. With help of the allies we liberated Europe, my own father was among the liberators. That is why Britain is different from the rest of the EU. Other countries border lines were frequently moved, they were conquered frequently, they were suppressed, in particular the former Communist Block countries. They are much more used to being ruled. Remainers may ridicule Leavers ‘little England’ mentality, but the history is different and has bred a different outlook. We despise a lack of proper democracy.

POGS, very good post, thank you for that information, very interesting. I hadn’t realised that the process had been changed this time round. Certainly Gondalez Pons has got it right, it’s high time the EU was more democratic, regardless of our being members or not. I’m afraid at the moment, it’s jobs for the boys (or girls) and no doubt, the EU will resist change. I wonder whether they will ever change, who knows?

Margaux

You say of the nomination and voting system in the EU in comparison to the UK:-

' And the EU equivalent of the civil service ( with additionally the power to propose legislation - which needs the approval of the Council and also the Parliament) is the Commission. '
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There is a big difference between ANY of the 28 nations 'administrations' , what we call in the UK the Civil Service, and the EU Parliament/Commission/Council as they are not ' ADMINISTRATORS ' , they are the law makers the 'LEGISLATORS '.
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You say :-

' All quite complex, but worth noting that both the Council ( proposing a candidate) and the Parliament (having to approve the candidate) are involved in the appointment of the Commission President - in the present case, Mrs von Der Leyden, who has yet to be fully approved.'
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That has been duely noted in previous posts and accepted.

However this year the EU Council nomination for the President of the EU Commission was not as usual undertaken under the ' SPITZENKANDIDATEN ' system.

Had the Council made the nomination for the President of the EU Commission under the 'Spitzenkandidaten' system then German politician Manfred Weber would have been the proposed candidate as he is Leader of the European People's Party , the ' largest ' of the EU Parliament political groupings.

Manfred Weber was overlooked this time by the EU Council, hence the nomination for President of the European Commission is now German Defence Minister Ursula von der Leyen, from Angela Merkel's German Christian Democratic Union.

Both Manfred Weber and Ursuala von der Leyen belong to the EPP grouping but many even in the EPP are unhappy .

Gonzalez Pons, spokesperson for the dominant centre-right EPP group in the parliament has said this :-

“The future of Europe can no longer be decided behind closed doors. The spizenkandidat process is not about one person or one name – the citizens of Europe want to elect the person who is governing Europe. This is not revolutionary, this is democracy.

“The council has the right to propose a candidate to lead the commission to lead the parliament. However, what the council doesn’t have the right to do is to ignore all the candidates that have been voted for by European citizens.” He said the approach of carving up other top jobs taken by EU leaders was “clearly against the treaties”.

So the conclusion by many is this was an EU Council backroom deal , ' possibly ' to appease Angel Merkel, who knows I believe Macron had a lot to say. Whatever the reasoning it cements the belief the EU does what the EU wants to do Democratic or not.

I think the EU Parliament will ' endorse ' Ursula von der Leyen as they don't like to rock the boat or give any other impression of total solidarity in the EU when push comes to shove.

counterpoint

I asked you:-

' What false claims? '
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I apologise. I see now it is the incorrect use of the words ' convicted of fraud ' rather than ' convicted of negligence '.

Subtlety but there is a difference.

Lemon grove. Yes, the Americans rallied round us during the war, but the loans that they gave us took many years to pay off. and delayed our recovery. A nice little earner for our ‘allies!’

These crooked appointments are great news and are giving Brexit movement impetus as people realise the way the EU mince accountability and democracy.

You couldn’t make it up, could you!!

As for Christine Lagarde, the new European Central Bank head, she is neither an economist nor a banker but a competition lawyer.

Let’s hope that the era of boom and bust has miraculously come to an end, or else the euro could be in trouble. Having served (and messed up) as head of the IMF, a political position, is no substitute for hands-on understanding of financial markets and economics. She was a full participant in the Project Fear anti-Brexit propaganda.

Worse, she too has been embroiled in scandal. She was caught in a row involving Bernard Tapie, a controversial businessman and politician who served time for fraud.

While France’s finance minister, she agreed to an arbitration panel to determine a dispute involving the tycoon which led to him being awarded a huge payout, since reversed.

Investigators claimed that she approved the scheme because Tapie backed Nicolas Sarkozy’s 2007 election campaign: this, they alleged, was a way of thanking him with taxpayers’ money.

She denied the allegations, which could have landed her with a one-year jail term. She was found guilty of “negligence” but, astonishingly, the Cour de Justice de la République waived any punishment or criminal record, citing her “international reputation” and role in dealing with “the international financial crisis” as IMF boss.

Urmstongran- "there are none so deaf as those who do not want to hear"

Josep Borrell’s woes are equally recent, and haven’t prevented his nomination as foreign policy chief.

Less than a year ago, as Spain’s Socialist foreign minister, he was fined €30,000 (£26,900) for insider trading. The regulator ruled he had engaged in “a very serious violation” of securities law when he sold shares in Abengoa in 2015, “having privileged information on this company”. As champagne socialism goes, this takes some beating and he refused calls to resign.

He also supports the disgusting clampdown on Catalonia, has made trouble over Gibraltar and agreed to set up a joint cybersecurity group with Russia last November – a move that won’t end well.

Last but not least, he will be worse than useless on Iran: in an interview with Politico, he said: “Iran wants to wipe out Israel. Nothing new with that. You have to live with it.” His appointment will prove catastrophic.

‘But she supports a United States of Europe and an EU army, so what other qualifications are required?’

Quite Urmstongran.

Ursula von der Leyen, the Commission president-designate, herself the daughter of a Eurocrat, has wasted many depressing years as Germany’s defence minister, presiding over a decrepit and underfunded Bundeswehr.

A devastating parliamentary report earlier this year exposed planes that can’t fly and guns that don’t shoot. Fewer than a fifth of its helicopters are combat ready.

It is almost impossible to find anybody in Germany who has a good word to say about von der Leyen, her appointment a clear case of rewards for failure. “Our weakest minister”, one said.

It gets worse: a parliamentary committee has launched an inquiry into a spending scandal in her department, relating to massive contracts awarded to consultants. But she supports a United States of Europe and an EU army, so what other qualifications are required?

And the EU equivalent of the civil service ( with additionally the power to propose legislation - which needs the approval of the Council and also the Parliament) is the Commission.

You could say that the EU is something of a three-legged stool: Council of Ministers, European Parliament, and European Commission.

All quite complex, but worth noting that both the Council ( proposing a candidate) and the Parliament (having to approve the candidate) are involved in the appointment of the Commission President - in the present case, Mrs von Der Leyden, who has yet to be fully approved.

Our civil service, which basically runs everything, is totally unelected. And populated by the public school boys’ club. Plus ca change, as we pro-Europeans say. Yes Minister all those years ago summed it up.

Am a bit puzzled by some of the comments here.

The way top officials are appointed is the result of a balance between the Council ( on which the elected representatives of the member states sit, including our own Prime Minister) and the Parliament ( with MEPs directly elected by the people, like Farage and Miss Widdecombe who boasted of the Brexit Party being the largest party in the European Parliament before suddenly portraying us as slaves).
Sovereignty is shared between all 28 members.

Unlike others who have commented here, I am deeply impressed by the talents and expertise of the new top people

Mrs von der Leyden is a medical doctor and economist who has held a number of cabinet posts in Germany and is the mother of 7 children.

Christine Lagarde is one of the world's most prominent policy-makers, has held a number of Ministerial posts in France, and has been a highly successful managing director of the IMF. She was implicated in a case and found guilty of negligence - NOT fraud- but no penalty was imposed.

Charles Michel has been an acting PM in Belgium, and his gifts or diplomacy are widely recognised.

The fact that we are leaving the EU is really no reason to start insulting our European neighbours. Would that the Brexit MEPs has an iota of the talents of the new officials - and behaved with dignity and diplomacy instead of taking the Parliament's shilling but utterly failing - as their predecessors UKIP failed - to advance the interests of the UK in the Parliament and promote democracy in Europe.

I’m a remainer but have always deplored the process of selecting EU leaders, nothing new about it. But it’s still better in than out. Despair for 31 October.

I'm a remainer and have no problem with appointments. Most top jobs in any sector are appointed, public, private and voluntary, why should EU be different. Look where elections have got us in this country and who we might get as PM through election process!

The quicker we get out, the better!

FC 61

"What I liked is her respect and defence of the military and reluctance to send them to fight Crimea but rely on sanctions . "
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Ursula von der Leyen is an arch EU Federalist who is in favour of an EU Army, Defense Union for those who can't call it what it is.

Her ' reluctance to send them to fight' will have little bearing if German troops are part of what she and Junker want, an EU Army.

She was found guilty of negligence, escaped a prison sentence and a criminal record. She has now been promoted to a top position in the commission! Chris Grayling is everything you say, but incompetence isn't a criminal offence, and he, without doubt will not be offered any job whatsoever and disappear without trace!

counterpoint

What false claims?

I'm shocked at the false claims against Christine Lagarde. Whether or not you like her, she is entitled to not be misrepresented. It is outrageous that people are saying she has been convicted of fraud or embezzlement. Please read the BBC report for the facts. www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38369822. Really, her "negligence" in relation to £340 million pales into significance by comparison with the trail of disaster wreaked by Chris Grayling. Not to mention the billions being spent on "no-deal Brexit", which is utter madness.