Drug deaths up over 20% in one year...in Scotland

I didn't mean Iam64, I meant Magistrates, ordinary folk,.

There ARE cases where there are generations of substance abusers in the same family who are selfish enough to have no concern about the effect their lifestyle choice is having on their families - of course and this is true of most people who are addicted, their need/compulsion for their drug of choice (or behaviour e.g. gambling) is paramount.

However that is different to saying that others do not experience harm from their addiction because "their addiction harms mostly themselves".

But now I see that I possibly misread what Iam meant, perhaps she meant that addiction is a personal choice and activity. However, families are harmed by having an addict in the family. That is not judgmental either, it is a fact.

Iam64 is not being judgemental - she is simply stating a fact.

There ARE cases where there are generations of substance abusers in the same family who are selfish enough to have no concern about the effect their lifestyle choice is having on their families.

Ordinary folk, who feel that everyone should be able to cope just as they do, can be very harsh.

Gonegirl, in fairness, many of those women are sentenced by Magistrates, ordinary folk, not Judges who never knew hardship. Offenders who can, get their cases transferred to Crown Court - sentencing is usually less harsh. Crazy world

(That in relation to Iam's post)

Too many holier than thou, stuck-up, cold-hearted, judges. Never known any hardship in their lives.

Sorry but I laughed out loud at the comment that most addictions only harm themselves. That is ludicrous - an addict affects their family, community, social circle and everything in between e.g. finances. (And when I talk about addiction I mean problematic use of alcohol and other drugs).

Here's more info:

adfam.org.uk/help-for-families/understanding-the-issues/the-effects

The link was not between drug-taking and Vitamin D SueDonim, but there is a link between lack of Vitamin D and depression and between depression and drug-taking; I was thinking laterally since other posters were discussing some other benefits of living in a warm, sunny climate compared to more damp, chilly areas of Europe.

I agree with you, Iam64.

You're right paddynan about the prisons being full of people whose addictions harm mainly themselves. I'd say that's mainly the women's prisons where many mothers are separated from their children as a result of shoplifting or benefit fraud. I don't defend either of those crimes of course and I don't say they're victim free, no crime is.
However, the cost to society of separating mothers and children should be factored in. Children may be split up and stay with various relatives, or go into foster care. Drug addicted mothers will be put onto methadone and come out after short sentences, no better off than they were when sentenced. I haven't yet met a mother imprisoned for those crimes who hadn't experienced childhood trauma and domestic abuse in adult life. They didn't pose a direct threat to anyone and prison for persistent shop lifting really shouldn't be the answer.

I think we need to look at the problem a different way like Portugal .they decriminalised all drugs over 10 years ago .If you are caught with more than 10 days worth on you you have to go in front of a panel that includes medical and legal representation .They CAN give you a fine ,often they dont but what they will do is offer help and advice.
As a result ,drug deaths plummetted ,HIV numbers dropped and addiction is less likely.Treating drug abuse as a medical/health problem instead of a criminal /moral issue seems to work there .WE need to try this here instead of filling prisons with people whose addictions harm mainly themselves.

Purely anecdotal, I know, but when I spent a lot of time in Scotland I met a lot of older type hippies, who had often moved there to escape the rat race.
A lot of them were recreational users, and had been for years, and their children, too as they grew up.

Most were quite comfortably off.

I'm sure winter gloom doesn't help but southern English winters are hardly balmy oases of Caribbean sunshine and warmth!

I've seen many a drug addict in warm and sunny California so I'm not sure there's a direct correlation.

Drug overdose deaths in the U.S. have dropped for the first time since the 90s- But here the epidemic effected both rich and poor-

Yes Gonegirl - hard to get away from that isn't it. As well as decriminalising, they upped the health/social support for addicts. That's been obvious to anyone working with substance misusers for ever - well certainly since I started in the work in 1978. It just hasn't changed since then, the obvious way forward I mean. What has changed, is we have many more substance misusers and far less services.

Portugal's drug deaths came down radically when they decriminalised drugs a few years back.

I think there's a link, Callistemon.
We had a holiday home in the Highlands during the '90s. Although it was beautiful there, I couldn't cope with the long 'summer' days and short winter days.
I think there's some research connecting lack of natural light with depression.

Norway, Sweden, Scotland

Portugal's drug deaths are minuscule.

All northern countries with less sunlight.
Could there be a link?

www.healthline.com/health/depression-and-vitamin-d

Ok apologies to all of those in Scotland! I am sure most of you love living there!

Why is it always the North East/North West which has the most drug and suicide problems ?

You didn't just describe your experience, JenniferEccles. You then went on to extrapolate from that that all of Scotland must be the same and that's why there is a drug problem.

Fwiw, where I live we have the same rainfall as London, no midges and it was 28deg earlier this week while people down south were complaining of the cold.

I certainly wasn’t trying to be goady. We are discussing why Scotland has such a bad alcohol and drug problem and I just described my experience there. Obviously there are many factors involved .

Yes, it's the highest in the EU, as this BBC chart shows. I was surprised that Norway & Sweden are also near the top of the league. I'd assumed that because we hear often of their more equal and caring society that they would have lower levels of substance abuse. It would be interesting to tease that one apart.

Portugal's drug deaths are minuscule.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-48853004

If youngsters are thrown out of their homes , is a government responsible