Liberal Democrats

They didn’t get their way for a 9th Dec GE.

Yes they did. They caused Corbyn to cave in. We would not be having an election without the Libdems and SNAP

Turns out that the Lib Dems and SNP weren’t calling the shots after all......

Although, to be fair Petra that is the leisurewear of choice for Comrade Corbyn as well.?

Well, Swinson didn’t get her way, or the SNP.....good!
A GE on Dec 12 th in spite of it being ‘cold, possibly dark and maybe even raining!’ ?

Bodach
I always think of knitted ties worn with an ill fitting shirt of a non- descript colour finished off with sandals and socks.

Libdems and SNP calling the shots

www.itv.com/news/2019-10-29/the-election-depends-on-libdem-and-snp-unity-of-purpose/

Many, many years ago, one of my friends at school was a staunch Liberal Party supporter (before they joined up with the SDP). He was a lovely lad, but his main preoccupation was railways - to the extent that he had memorised virtually all of the railway timetable in Scotland. If you wanted to know when the next train from, say, Thurso to Perth was leaving, then he was your man. Ask him about anything concerning the wider world, and he would eventually steer the conversation back to the railway network. Whenever I see Jo Swinson & Co trying to pretend that the Lib Dems have anything beyond denial to offer in the current debate on Brexit, my old friend comes inexorably to mind...

Brilliant speech by LibDem leader Jo Swinson

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbcparliament

starts at 16.04

Jo Swinson has defended her plan to hold a general election on December 9th - before Brexit is resolved.

The Lib Dem leader, who together with the SNP's Westminster leader Ian Blackford has put forward a tightly-drafted Bill that would grant an election on December 9, said their plan is "sensible".

She told the Today programme: "It seems to me a sensible way forward. We also understand from our contacts in the EU that putting forward this bill and sending the letter that we did has helped out EU friends have confidence that if they offer the extension that they're discussing today that that will be time well spent.

"One of their big concerns was that they offered an extension earlier this year, said 'don't waste the time', and then we had a Conservative leadership election and Boris Johnson mucked about not trying to get a deal, shutting down parliament, and you know, the very master class in time wasting so, understandably, they had a degree of reluctance, I think evidenced by the fact they didn't grant the extension on Friday when many thought they would.

"So I'm hopeful that as a result of what we've done we will see that extension granted today because otherwise we're still in the very real risk of crashing out without a deal on Thursday."

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/jo-swinson-lib-dem-plan-for-general-election-1-6344193

You have to look at motives for not jumping on the Labour NHS amendment bandwagon

"It goes like this.

You lay down an amendment that has a bit of good stuff in it, and you combine it with something that another party just isn’t going to go for. Then when they don’t vote for your amendment you go after them on social media.

Today Labour’s amendment read as follows;

*At end add ‘but respectfully regrets that the Gracious Speech does not repeal the Health and Social Care Act 2012 to restore a publicly provided and administered National Health Service and protect it from future trade agreements that would allow private companies competing for services who put profit before public health and that could restrict policy decisions taken in the public interest.*’

Now I know that many, including me, in this party had concerns about the reforms in the 2012 Act. But there was some good stuff in there, on social care and on mental health, both issues very important to us. So even if we think that the Act isn’t perfect, we would go with amending rather than appealing repealing it.
www.libdemvoice.org/of-course-the-lib-dems-oppose-exposing-our-nhs-in-future-trade-deals

(I think "appealing" in the last line was meant to be "repealing" so I have crossed it through and added "appealing")

LibDem policy statemant "Save the NHS and Social
Care by Stopping Brexit"

d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/libdems/pages/46346/attachments/original/1564404757/137_-_Save_the_NHS_and_social_care_by_stopping_brexit.pdf?1564404757

Just going by their votes that's how you know what they stand for, look at the voting record.

According to the independent factchecker Fullfact , "It’s misleading to claim the Lib Dems refused to support an end to NHS privatisation"

fullfact.org/health/liberal-democrat-nhs-privatisation/

Why would Jo Swinson back Labour's Health and Social Care Act vote she voted for it so did the Tories the Tories and Lib Dems in her party.

The Health and Social Care Act should never have been passed. It stops the health secretary being responsible paves the way for private companies to be awarded NHS contracts. So needs to be gotten rid of ASAP.

The government documents Five Year Forward View, their so-called Sustainability and Tranformation Plans and the Ten Year Plan are nearly the last pieces in the jigsaw of their privatisation polices.

Professor Hawking. They didn't call him a genius for noting. It wasn't his field but he was spot on. He summed it up on a sentence. The NHS is being replaced by forty-four US-style insurance-based private organisations. No question.

Jeremy voted remain and campaigned vigorously for remaining in the 2016 referendum as has been documented.
Labour want to get a deal with the EU and put it before the people with the option to remain can't say fairer than that, as the vote was fairly evenly split between leave and remain.

The LibDems certainly would vote with Labour if they tried to stop brexit but that seems unlikely as long as the brexiter Corbyn is LP leader.

Lib Dem’s will never vote with Labour on anything.

Labour won’t vote with the SNP.

Fact Check on the Labour amendment yesterday: It was repealing 500 pages of legislation and putting nothing in its place. The Health and Social care act has a lot wrong with it, but just scrapping it and putting nothing in its place leaves an untenable legislative void.
This was from facebook; I don't know how true it is. I am trying to find out more.

Swanson's lack of political nowse was demonstrated in that abstention in the run-up to a GE.

The best chances for the Lib-Dems is with tactical voting. It seems to me that the Tory voters can split 3 ways: Brexit-Tory-Lib but on the other hand Labour votes are only likely to split 2 ways, Lib-Lab. This implies that the Lib-Dems have more to gain by supporting LP's supporters favoured policies than making life easier for the Tory voters.

I accept that a popular view is that the Brexit Party is a real alternative for Labour voters however I don't subscribe to that view as most Labour voters are firstly anti Tory, even before being pro-labour, yes it's a cultural thing, and the Brexit Party is, was and will be seen to be a Tory party splinter group.

Will the ex-miners or steel workers of Yorkshire or the ex-ship builders of Sunderland or the Boilermakers of Sellifield vote in massive numbers for a Tory government , it is unlikely, but they may well vote for Lib-Dems hoping to produce a hung Parliament to get rid of Corbyn and Johnson together with their cliques.

Meaningless vote or not, varian, it was not a good look for the LibDems. It's given Labour supporters another thing to hate and alienated some LibDem supporters. I don't see why they had to abstain, and neither do lots of other people.

I agree with Elegran. This was a meaningless vote on part of the Queens Speech which will be voted down. It is nothing to do with keeping the Tories in power. The LibDems are not against working with other parties but will not go into coalition with a Johnson led Tory Party of a Corbyn led Labour Party.

As we are clearly on the run up to a GE, we can expect to see parties attacking each other at every opportunity and as the LibDems are set to make gains, they will be particularly targetted.

I'm failing to understand why Swinson is not supporting (or being) the Opposition. The Lib Dems are never going to be the party of government. If there is a hung parliament after the next GE she surely can't be stupid enough to even contemplate keeping the tories in power, so why antagonise the LP and left of centre voters now?

Perhaps varian might have an answer.

elegran whatever the reason, it is not a very clever tactic is it? Not a good look.

Although I suspect Swinson was more worried about giving a Corbyn a winning vote.

As I’ve previously said she is too politically immature to be a leader at present, and this sort of decision shows her immaturity.