raising pension age

Yes me too growstuff . It’s too close to reality for comfort .

I think there should be some sort of special punishment for those who go around calling those whose circumstances they have no knowledge of "feckless". Such a nasty, spiteful little word.

I have a horrible feeling they've already worked that one out, gillybob.

How do you work that one out, quizqueen? Many people have worked all their lives in low paid jobs or are disabled or have been parents/carers. They haven't had the opportunity to build up a big pension pot. Would you rather they just rotted away when they can no longer earn an income?

The "pot of money" wouldn't go round if we had fewer people because GDP would be lower and most of the new immigrants are younger and fitter than the people already living here. They use fewer resources, earn money for the country (via taxes) and often go back to their country of origin after a few years. They're actually supporting the population which is getting older and more inactive.

Did you read my post about my friendquizqueen she has fought cancer 3 times ,the first just months after the birth of her son 40 years ago .she lost a kidney that time and part of her stomach .The second time she lost her womb and ovaries ,this latest bout sees her waiting for reconstruction of her breast .Add her early onset dementia to the mix along with an ex who left after telling her he "didn't sign up for this" and feckless isn't a word I would ever use to describe her.

Sadly she is not unique in this vile conservative run "union" the DWP want folk to die rather than help them thats why they pay more to the agencies that screen benefits that the benefits would cost .I hope that you and your family never reach the dark place my friend inhabits now ..she worked her socks off while she was fit .Have you seen the deaths caused by this "caring" government due to their austerity that wasn't needed but was ideological ?

As usual it will the ones who work hard who suffer, and the feckless will continue to get everything for free. If the population of the UK was lower, people wouldn't be fighting for services, housing etc. The finite pot of money and space would be more than enough to go round and things would be cheaper as it would be a buyer/renters market with a glut of properties and jobs available putting more spending money into everyone's hands.

Why don't they just cancel all state pensions for those yet to retire all together ?

Then those of us who are not wealthy, have private pensions or valuable assets can just work until the bitter end. It would save all the hassle. We could just get our coffins delivered to our workplace. It could work you know.

I started this thread in good faith, but - courtesy of GN - having found out the real reason for Trump's strange behaviour over Greenland (i.e. a made-up excuse not to visit Denmark in case he was outshone by Obama), I'm just starting to wonder if "raise the retirement age to 75" is a ploy to deflect the criticism that is bound to result whichever way the judicial review on Waspi/Back to 60 comes out in a few weeks?

Option one: The review says the acceleration was unfair and the current Waspis should get some form of financial support (backdated) for the real difficulties many of us are in.

We are all supposed to say "no thanks", I can't take help from young people saddled with education/housing debt, no security of employment and forced to wait until they are 75 themselves?"

Option 2: The review says the timescale was fair and the warnings adequate.

We are all supposed to think, "Phew! Thank goodness I only have to struggle til I am 66 or 67. Could have been 75. Dodged a bullet there!

I think we have to accept that we are now a third world country and the only way to avoid starving to death in old age will soon be the hope that our unemployed descendants will be able to spare a few chips

Of course it doesn't gillybob. You don't vote Conservative.

I agree with you, by the way, which is why I've been keen to stress averages, which gloss over the fact that there are many with much less than average wealth/income.

So many assumptions that as we get older we are wealthy, have final salary pensions, in fact have any private pensions , have valuable assets or homes . What about those who don’t have any of these? Or I suppose it doesn’t matter does it?

Here in the North East we have a much lower life expectancy than many of the wealthier regions of the UK . Basically we will not retire we will just be wheeled out of the workplace in the box .

Considering how many people in the 70/75 age group I know who are waiting for hospital appointments and operations I am wondering how much of the week they would be at work. Good health at this age is such a lottery. Also the 20 to 40 year olds aren't going to take too well to being told how much better it was 40 years ago. OH said he certainly wouldn't be very good at dealing with people on the phone now, hearing issues and a definite leaning towards telling people the truth!!

You'll be fine if you make it to 75, GracesGran. It's the ten or so years before then which are the problem - the years when most people think they might be able to relax a little and maybe spend some of their savings on a few luxuries.

Sorry, only just come to this thread and haven't read it all. I have looked to see if this info has been posted and can't see it. Apparently we have the worst state pension in the OECD and should all have lived in The Netherlands. Worth a read.

www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/02/retirees-in-these-countries-receive-100-of-a-working-salary/

There are days, growstuff, when living to 75 seems less and less attractive.

That's what is behind the suggestion to raise the state pension age.

On the one hand, it is true that on average pensioners have never been so well off (as a result of generous final salary pensions and property prices). It's also true that people are living longer, but not necessarily in good health.

It's not true that people have paid for their own state pension. They paid for their parents and grandparents and the next generation has paid for them. There are no individual "pots".

Something has to happen.

I think the think tank know very well that most people can't work until they are 75 and the idea would be that they take out some kind of insurance/pension policy to cover the gap. Some people, sadly, won't make it to 75.

That means that people who are unable to fund a transition period are going to be in poverty, but the b****s don't care. The mantra will be that they were feckless and the smug ones will point out how they worked hard, etc etc.

The days of a state pension for most will be over.

There is a strange disbelief in the welfare state which protected us as we grew up growstuff. A large number of people now believe they got to where they are with no help at all. Thatcher may have meant something different, but killing off 'society' seems to be the aim of the moment.

The state pension age has never been 63 for all.

It was raised in the 1990s (can't remember exactly when) to 65, but was staged. I remember the day it was announced and working out that my date of birth meant I was one of the youngest to have to work to 65. I cursed a lot, but I thought it was fair.

It was raised again in 2011, which I think was unfair because it gave so little notice.

I also think it's unfair that the benefits system was changed. Before 2011 men and women over 60 only had to work for 16 hours a week before being eligible for Working Tax Credit. That meant that they could wind down and possibly receive a top up to their income. Now they have to work at least 30 hours, the same as all other working age people. There have also been other changes such as raising the age for free bus passes in most areas.

I think you're wrong growstuff the increase was to be to 63 ..it was much more recent than the 1990's that it was raised again.Thats what the complaint is WE didn't get enough time to make alternative plans .

Meanwhile the tories have managed to increase the national debt and its rising....

They can't take their state pension earlier Jura. Much as I would like to agree with you, you're muddling up two very different things.

jura2 Couldn't agree more.

NO MP or MEP should be allowed to take their pension before 'normal' people - their pension age has to match.

There was a trial of universal basic income in Finland but it was discontinued. [Therefore] It can't have been successful.

That's quite a leap Jane10. As I understand it there was a change in government. Various trials have been tried around the world. I believe Canada's was interesting and India are trying one too. Some are not actually Basic Income but more of a form of Negative Income tax. One form of BI is in place in Sherman County, Oregon. The United States is new to the subject but currently, there seems to some economic interest, as opposed to the social interest in most countries, in the US.